• The new B5TV.COM is here. We've replaced our 16 year old software with flashy new XenForo install. Registration is open again. Password resets will work again. More info here.

Apocalypse BoX

ok arn't there suppose to be 6 of these box's floating around?

I always figured that it had somthing to do with the first ones(including Shadows or vorlons in first ones ) or that they at least knew about it and what it was.

I figured maybe it was a first one gone mad or part of a first one gone mad that had to be imprisioned by other first ones cause it was so evil.

One theory of mine was that maybe it was part of a possessed Vorlon maybe one that had been possessed via the first thirdspace incident then imprisoned in the box.

But I am sure it is as old as the first ones and pretty sure the thing inside the box is imprisoned..

------------------
Deviot
Lincbot@yahoo.com.au
 
Wow, the box taking control of Gideon? That would have been so cool!

I should stop reading these posts, because every time I learn something new about Crusade I get so mad it was canceled.

I repeat, sunuvabich!

------------------
"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
 
I read somewhere on this site about what the Apocalypse Box would eventually be revealed as. I didn't make this up; this is what I read, and apparently, it would've been what the show would REALLY be about.

Naturally, it's a big spoiler. Here ya go:

<table bgcolor=black><tr><td bgcolor=black><font size=1 color=white>Spoiler:</font></td></tr><tr><td><font size=2 color=black>

Billions of years ago, when the First Ones made the decision to leave the galaxy, some of them chose to stay for their own reasons. The Vorlons stayed to help the younger races through order and discipline. The Shadows stayed to shape the younger races through chaos and conflict.

Then there was the third race. They hated the younger races with a passion. They were jealous of them, and they believed that the galaxy was theirs alone. We don't know what they called themselves, so for the sake of brevity, we'll call them the Heretics, for obvious reasons.

Naturally, both the Vorlons and Shadows didn't want the Heretics to succeed in their plans for galactic extinction. So, for the one and only time in their histories, they banded together in common cause to defend the younger races against the Heretics.

The war was brutal, horrific beyond that of even the Shadow Wars. In the end, the Vorlons and the Shadows were victorious (obviously), and the Heretics were exterminated ... except for six of them. These were the most powerful, most clever, most hateful of them all. For whatever reason, the Vorlons and the Shadows chose not to kill these six surviving Heretics, but to lock each of them away in very special prisons designed by both of the victors. These prisons were impenetrable, invulnerable, impossible to escape from ... with one caveat. If these prisons were brought together, the prisoners would be able to work together to free themselves, all at once.

These prisons have changed hands countless times through the millennia. Some of them were sealed away on certain planets, some were believed lost forever, but one of them has endured, more or less out in the open. And over time, because of the circumstances that follow it, this single prison became known as ...

... the Apocalypse Box.

Yeah. THAT'S what the Box would have been revealed as, if the series had been allowed to continue.

</font></td></tr></table>

Sure, the Box would have been guiding Gideon to find a cure for the Drakh Plague, but it would've had an ulterior motive in mind as it slowly worked its will over Gideon. And in exchange for the cure, it would've made its price known, the obvious would have happened ...

<table bgcolor=black><tr><td bgcolor=black><font size=1 color=white>Spoiler:</font></td></tr><tr><td><font size=2 color=black>

... the Boxes would be opened, and the Heretics unleashed on an unsuspecting galaxy, with only the Excalibur leading the battle against them ...

</font></td></tr></table>

... and that would be that.

And NO, I'm not making this up. Even MY fevered imagination couldn't come up with something this diabolical. But if TNT had left jms alone, to do the show HIS way, the RIGHT way, it would've been a ratings bonanza for them.

Still, there's hope that, if Legend of the Rangers is successful, we still might see this storyline come to light. That's why the spoilers before.

MAN, I hope this show gets back on the air!!!

------------------
 
In Valen's Shadow--Are you sure that your explanation isn't just someone's speculation? I don't see why JMS would have allowed something like that to leak out, so I have some doubts about the authenticity.

There was a discussion of the Apocalypse Box on this board a couple of months ago, and one of the more interesting theories was similar in that it involved the Apocalypse Boxes being the broken off pieces of one of the First Ones, who was trying to to reunite the pieces of itself by hitching a ride with someone that it knew would be exploring the galaxy for ancient alien technology.

Another idea that someone had was that the Box was telepathic, and that whenever we see Gideon talking to the Box out loud, it's really all happening in his mind. That would explain why the guy in "The Path of Sorrows" suddenly got all nervous, because the box said something to him telepathically that we (the audience, as well as the others at the poker table) couldn't hear.


------------------
 
Given that the Crusade Writer's Bible hints that the box might be older than the Shadows/Vorlons, I seriously doubt that that background is true.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> I read somewhere on this site about what the Apocalypse Box would eventually be revealed as. I didn't make this up; this is what I read, and apparently, it would've been what the show would REALLY be about.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you read it on This site, it had to be in the Fan Fiction section, since that's about the only section I skip parts of.

I know JMS never said it, and that's the only opinion that counts. After all, it's His Story.



------------------
Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zathras:
PURE Speculation:

I believe it was a JMS post (somebody help me out) that said that later on in the series the Apocalypse Box would begin to speak wit Gideon's voice. What if the box is some kind of "radio receiver" that is getting messages from the future, and Gideon, himself, is sending the messages to his past self from some point in the future to warn him of trouble and guide him in his quest. The box tried to warn Gideon of Galen's intentions at the Well of Forever, maybe that was a warning from foreknowledge. What if Galen is a real traitor and the Gideon of the future knows this and is trying to prevent some event in his past.

If you saw the movie "Frequency," it's kinda the same idea.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Got to be another reason. Voice to cryptic, not saying very much. Gideon would know he would have to speak loudly and carry a big stick to get Matthew away from Galen into the non-trust category. Gideon feels a kinship because Galen saved his life, plus I think they just like each other.

No, has to be another reason other than that one.

I don't think it is either Shadow, Vorlon or anything else we have seen to date.

Would make an interesting story somewhere on down the line don't ya think?




------------------
Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GKarsEye:
Wow, the box taking control of Gideon? That would have been so cool!

I should stop reading these posts, because every time I learn something new about Crusade I get so mad it was canceled.

I repeat, sunuvabich!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah, repeat it again for me gorgeous!

Hissssssssssssssssssss




------------------
Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by In Valen's Shadow:
I read somewhere on this site about what the Apocalypse Box would eventually be revealed as. I didn't make this up; this is what I read, and apparently, it would've been what the show would REALLY be about.

Naturally, it's a big spoiler. Here ya go:
MAN, I hope this show gets back on the air!!!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I had that an idea similar to that in the beginning and was told i was a nut case. LOL. Nice to know someone thinks like I do.

great outcome don't ya think, but I don't want a mental takeover of Gideon. That is a difficult thing to overcome, I imagined it someone differently.

But certainly, would be a thrilling way to end a cyclical story considering the plague isn't really the end all of end alls.




------------------
Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
 
I keep thinking of Greek mythology, and Pandoras Box. According to the legend, the Box was filled with all kinds of horrible things that plage mankind, disease, war, nightmares, etc...luckily Pandora closed the Box before one last thing could escape...in the book I have, the thing that is trapped in the Box is the KNOWLEDGE OF THE FUTURE. If mankind knew everything that was going to happen, all hope would be lost.


------------------
Eat More Goat.
 
Here is my two cents.
As far as I know the Apocalypse Box is older than the shadows and the shadows are supposed to be the Second oldest race in the Galaxy. Witch in my Opinion only Leaves two options.


1. One of Loren's race went insane or was just plain evil, and they could not kill him or did not want to kill him so they broke him into six Peaces and put them each into a box.


2. A signal entity Develop of great power (maybe it was evil I don't know) but for some reason Loren's race broke it into six Peaces. Same as last time
Maybe they could not kill it or did not want to kill it so they broke it into six Peaces and put them each into a box.

If I am Wrong Feel free to correct.

------------------
"Well take this for what little it will profit you. As I look at you, Ambassador Mollari, I see a great hand reaching out of the stars. The hand is your hand. And I hear sounds, the sounds of billions of people calling your name."
"My followers?"
"Your victims."
-- Elric and Londo in Babylon 5:"The Geometry of Shadows"
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zathras:
PURE Speculation:

I believe it was a JMS post (somebody help me out) that said that later on in the series the Apocalypse Box would begin to speak wit Gideon's voice.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think you may be on to something with the voice - in an early ep it didn't speak with his voice, but it does later. This implies to me a growing link between Gideon and the box... perhaps like the ring in 'Lord of the Rings'? It can only be used for evil? It uses the user?

Just a wild guess.....


------------------
 
Yes, I do believe it said on some website that the box would start talking in Gideon's voice.

This site has some good information on the The Apocalypse Box. http://www.zeshan.com/babylon5/apb.htm


------------------
"Well take this for what little it will profit you. As I look at you, Ambassador Mollari, I see a great hand reaching out of the stars. The hand is your hand. And I hear sounds, the sounds of billions of people calling your name."
"My followers?"
"Your victims."
-- Elric and Londo in Babylon 5:"The Geometry of Shadows"
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>luckily Pandora closed the Box before one last thing could escape...in the book I have, the thing that is trapped in the Box is the KNOWLEDGE OF THE FUTURE. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I hate to break this to you, but that book is Wrong.
The last thing in Pandora's Box was HOPE.
Pandora is eventually persuaded to open the box and release Hope so that the world would not be doomed to eternal despair.



------------------
Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?
 
Just found this, don't know how accuarate it might be:

"For those unfamiliar with the myth of Pandora, it commonly stems from two written traditions of which the earliest is Hesiod, who we believe to have been writing sometime in the 7th century BC. According to his 'Theogony' and 'Works and Days' Hesiod claims that Pandora was made by Hephaestus at Zeus's command. She was made beautiful, gifted by all the Gods and given a deceitful and lying nature, becoming a beautiful evil and in so being, a punishment to man in revenge for Prometheus stealing fire from Zeus to give to men. Hermes takes Pandora to Prometheus's brother, Epimetheus who, despite prior warning to the contrary, takes her into his household. Once there, she takes the lid off a great jar that stood in Epimetheus house and all the evils and misery in the world flew out to inhabit the world. Hope alone remained in the jar. This was Zeus's punishment.

The second important written version is that of Babrius, writing in the 2nd Century AD. In his fable he states that Zeus put all Good things in a jar and placed it among men. Through curiosity man removed the lid and the blessings flew heavenwards to be lost to the men on Earth. Only Hope was trapped in the jar and remained.

These were the two main literary traditions taken up in future art and literature although other variants of the myth did occur derived from oral tradition and ancient religious rituals. These components provided the basis for the diverse interpretations of the Pandora myth throughout the Ages. As will become evident such interpretations have ranged from seeing Pandora as Man's ultimate benefactor to their Fatal Hybris; from the Earth Goddess to the Femme Fatale. Whatever the interpretation Pandora's Myth has had an appeal that has managed to endure right up to the present day."

------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo

[This message has been edited by hypatia (edited August 09, 2001).]
 
I think it's funny that both the ancient Greek/Roman pagan religions and the Christian religion blame all of the evils on the world on women.

------------------
"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> I think you may be on to something with the voice - in an early ep it didn't speak with his voice, but it does later. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The Box ALWAYS spoke with Gideon's voice. When we heard it speak in Crusade it was with Gary Cole's voice heavily distorted.



------------------
Demon
 
I think that was the point of the story-if mankind knew everything that was going to happen, they would lose all hope. so our stories are both correct...from a certain point of view.

------------------
Eat More Goat.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GKarsEye:
I think it's funny that both the ancient Greek/Roman pagan religions and the Christian religion blame all of the evils on the world on women.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, it is predictable. Look at the separation of rights in these cultures.

No matter how bad today seems, ancient history was almost always much much harder on women than today. What am I saying? Today for me, in the USA. I shudder when I hear what India does to thier women.

It is actually hard for me to reconcile the teachings of Ghandi with the daily practices in many villages in that culture. If a woman discovers her baby is a female, she frequently aborts. There are villages that have no native women. I wonder what genetics will do to them in the long run, I really do.

Anyhow, I'm lucky to be where I am, that is for certain.

------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> It is actually hard for me to reconcile the teachings of Ghandi with the daily practices in many villages in that culture. If a woman discovers her baby is a female, she frequently aborts. There are villages that have no native women. I wonder what genetics will do to them in the long run, I really do.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is worse than that. Societies with an excess of women can work - the men just have to run harems. The opposite is very dangerous. Men without women frequently turn to violence. The boys only rule will probably give India and China very aggressive armies. The boys are becoming men about now. Remember the story of the founding of Rome.

------------------
Andrew Swallow
 

Latest posts

Members online

No members online now.
Back
Top