B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

[Triple F]

Also "Quantum Space" was stupid and unnecessary, presenting a ton of new issues, complications and opportunities for the universe and yet treated as an offhand light hearted kind of joke.

The gag with the reporter was always in the script but the inclusion of Quantum space appears to have been a late addition – maybe to make it easier for the viewer to understand why she puked.

But like you said, it does knock continuity a bit with it just being slipped into the script.

I remember the original version of the script didn't have Quantum space. It was simply Hyperspace. The gag with the reporter was the same though, except her nausea was caused by sitting in the "God room" while the jump point was forming. The idea being that most people would be unable to handle seeing, and feeling, space being warped so closely in front of them - usually they'd be in the bowels of the ship I suppose. She didn't have her "space legs", as it were. I'm not sure why it was changed, but personally I prefer the original version.

Quantum space was described as "Hyperspace, but blue". Paul Hegg came up with the look of it eventually, using animated displacements and a few layered procedural textures. We wanted to add some moving volumetric stuff into that one shot, which the ship would be seen flying through, but there wasn't enough time.

http://themadgoner.com/B5/B5Scrolls/B5Scrolls.htm#Screen1_14_4

 

[vacantlook]

I like that original version too. I wonder if it was some kind of budgetary concerns that prevented them from doing the original version.

 

[Triple F]

I can’t see it being budgetary. The jump point is still created and the environment had to be created from scratch whether it was red or blue.

I’ve not heard anything, but I can’t help thinking about what happened when LOTR came out. Remember, one of the (many) complaints was how hyperspace looked different. By throwing hyperspace out the window and creating Quantum space you neutralise any potential comments this time.

You create others of course (for example how did minbari/humans get hold of this left over Vorlon tech if we ain’t meant to get to their home world for a million years) . . . . . well, it’s just a thought. Stupid one really I suppose.

 

[vacantlook]

It both involves CGI, but I imagine that it costs more to combine live-action footage with CGI than to just a 100% CGI shot. Showing a CGI ship in CGI space jump into a CGI jumpoint would all be CGI, but showing Sheridan and the reporter in the "God room" surrounded by space and the jump-point would take a totally different process of technology than just an all-CGI shot.

As for the complaints about the way hyperspace looked in LOTR, I personally think it's stupid. One, I view the difference as one of technology. Two, I like the rough, tumultuous appearance of hyperspace in LOTR. If technology had been as advanced when B5 was originally being done, then I have no doubt hyperspace would've looked the way it did in LOTR. Quantum space creates a whole new slew of questions, most specifically, where in the world did it come from. I'd like to think that jms has something resembling an interesting story in his brain/notebook about it even if we never learn what that is. TLT was such an addendum concept that I don't know if it would've ever been covered in it, or whatever, but like too many B5 projects since the end of the show, TLT was ended too early for us to ever know.

It's not a stupid thought to wonder where the tech for quantum jump tech came from. Timelines have never been my forte, but perhaps quantum jump technology is something that came about from the story that they crew of the Liandra in LOTR were going to go through. Their story, which who knows how it would've eventually progressed and what it would've involved, did begin with a story about some ancient race (the Chronologies script book says it was one of the First Ones) being locked away in another dimension of space (the Chronogies says they were locked away by other First Ones). Maybe that other dimension brought about quantum space jump technologies. Again, I don't know if the timeline fits cause the timing of anything outside of the B5 series confuses me in terms of timing. But I could see it working that way.

 

[Triple F]

Good point. I wasn’t thinking about the additional work involved in compositing if they relied on her visually seeing it in the ‘God Room’. You didn’t see inside the ship in the final version either, which does point at cost/time possibly being a factor.

Your right, there’s a lot of ‘teasers’ floating around B5 in general and the later movies in particular.

As I haven’t read any of the books. Did earth help Vir rid Centauri Prime of the Drakh or something. As the reasoning behind prince whats-his-face wanting to wipe out earth still eludes me (based on what appears on screen anyway). The only power to have stopped the Centauri in the past!! (or something like that)

 

[Jade Jaguar]

Finally saw this. The first story felt really out of place. It kind of ignored the entire past history of the show's main arc. Haven't we already established that many religions were heavily influenced by the Vorlons and Shadows fucking with us? Why would Lochley ignore all of the knowledge in the B5 universe to date and turn to theology as the only rational explanation for the observed phenomenon. This is a universe with overpowered telepaths, absurdly old races presenting themselves as dieties and a cast of main characters who are fully aware of the recent history. I'm not saying that we couldn't have had the story play out the way it did... but I want to see a lot more skepticism and reasoning coming from a character who otherwise has demonstrated leadership on Babylon 5..

I agree completely. I hadn't put my finger on it quite like that before, but that is definitely what didn't seem right to me in that ep.

 

[KoshN]

As I haven’t read any of the books. Did earth help Vir rid Centauri Prime of the Drakh or something.

No. It's all in "Legions of Fire" and you should read it. Great trilogy. Ditto for "The Passing of the Techno-mages." IMHO, the Psi Corps trilogy was not quite as good as the other two.

As the reasoning behind prince whats-his-face wanting to wipe out earth still eludes me (based on what appears on screen anyway). The only power to have stopped the Centauri in the past!! (or something like that)

Well, John Sheridan is human, from Earth and was part of Earthforce. He was the leader of the IA when Centauri (manipulated by the Drakh) attacked IA shipping, and was defeated and forced to pay reparations to Alliance worlds (The Fall of Centauri Prime).

 

[fisheggs]

And don't forget, the Centari have seen the Mimbari go "insane" and know neither the Vorlon nor Shadow will protect them.:devil: Earth might just have been a safer bet.