Could The Crusade Storyline Incorporate a New Crew?

[KoshN]

Although I don't expect I'm going to be too popular for saying this, I simply don't believe that anyone is ever going to pay to revive a series that ran for 13 episodes 8 years ago, was never really a critical success,

I don't think anybody expects Crusade to be revived as a series. The best we could possibly hope for is some stories in the Crusade storyline in Babylon 5 - The Lost Tales.

...currently enjoys virtually zero public awareness (doesn't even have name recognition),

Heh, the same could be said of all of Babylon 5. Yes, I know that Crusade has less name recognition than Babylon 5, but what I'm saying is that Babylon 5, itself, has next to no public awareness and name recognition right now. Back when Crusade came out, they should have called it Babylon 5 - Crusade, but all that's water under the bridge, now.

is known to have led to enormous friction between the network and the main creative force,

I doubt that anybody cares about that.

...was in many senses broken before it aired,

True, thanks to TNT-Atlanta.

...and divided even fans of the B5 universe over its quality.

Well, fans are divided on the Rangers pilot, as well.<shrug>

It makes no business sense whatsoever (at least to me) to revive that storyline on that premise as a series.

It depends on how well the Babylon 5 - The Lost Tales are received, i.e. how hungry the public is for more stories the B5 universe. However, I'm not holding out any hope. The average member of the public has crappy taste.

Heck, the initial (year one) premise wasn't even a premise that JMS wanted to do until TNT started making suggestions.

However, that could be made to work.

Obviously the plague storyline is one of the biggest outstanding unresolved questions in the B5 universe at the moment,

That, and The Telepath War,

...and I expect we'll see it addressed (or at least referred to) in TLT

I hope they devote some B5:TLT episodes to it, instead of just giving it a passing mention.

... or other future projects, where we already know that members of the cast (such as Galen) will show up.

If there are any future projects.

And I expect the secondary 'real' premise might return in some form, although to be honest the tiny snippets we know about going renegade and leftover shadowtech make it sound like material that was already amply covered in Babylon 5

Not really. It was covered much more thoroughly in the Centauri and Technomage novel trilogies (not the going renegade, stuff), and that means that almost nobody knows about it because it seems that very few people read books anymore.

... (although I accept JMS might have had some new twists up his sleeve that he's never revealed).

I guess you haven't read the trilogies?

I also don't want to exclude the possibility that it might be revisited as a TV movie.

That's not enough coverage for this. A miniseries of 20 hours or so, or a series of B5:TLT DVDs would be more like what would be needed.

But after all this time I think any new series projects in the current incarnation of B5 would be much more likely to have a new premise, free of all that baggage.

Yeah, they tried that with Rangers. Look how well that did. No, I think there's more demand for completion of a story that was left hanging, and that could happen a little at a time in the B5:TLT DVD releases. Trouble is, that's going to be REALLY SLOW coming out. We'll be lucky to get two hours of show every 6 months.

(and sorry Legend of the Rangers fans, I don't think that one's likely to get revived either )

Thank God!

 

[b4bob]

I don't think time has been very kind to Crusade. When I watched the DVD's a few years ago, the good episodes were worse than I remembered, and the bad ones seemed terrible. I'm for the JoeD approach: start over and recast as necessary.

I really wish JMS would just break down and give us a Crusade novel or three. I think he mentioned at one point it was difficult selling such an idea to publishers, but I think he could convince them if he really wanted to. Hell, those Mongoose guys are begging for B5 material to publish...

 

[KoshN]

I really wish JMS would just break down and give us a Crusade novel or three. I think he mentioned at one point it was difficult selling such an idea to publishers, but I think he could convince them if he really wanted to. Hell, those Mongoose guys are begging for B5 material to publish...

It's not up to JMS to convince publishers of anything, and Mongoose wouldn't do justice to the story. What's needed is a publisher at least as big as Del Rey to go to Warner Brothers, pay a licensing fee, and get good novel authors to write the books based upon JMS outlines, and that isn't happening. Evidently, there are not enough of us (who want the books). Otherwise, Del Rey would have re-upped.

 

[PillowRock]

one a bald Englishman dressed neckt-to-toe in enveloping black, the other an alien female in heavy make-up and prosthetics.

The other side of that coin is:

The exact reasons that you give for switching those two cast members not being insurmountable even with ACtA ...... are also exactly why those two actors could conceivable pick up the roles a decade later and not have their aging be a particular problem.

Assuming, of course, that they were available and interested.

 

[b4bob]

It's not up to JMS to convince publishers of anything, and Mongoose wouldn't do justice to the story. What's needed is a publisher at least as big as Del Rey to go to Warner Brothers, pay a licensing fee, and get good novel authors to write the books based upon JMS outlines, and that isn't happening. Evidently, there are not enough of us (who want the books). Otherwise, Del Rey would have re-upped.

1. I didn't mean for someone else to write it. I want JMS to write it. He's written novels before, so why not now? It would be the next best thing to having a multi-year show produced (maybe even better). I know JMS doesn't own the license, but if he really wanted to write some Crusade novels, I'm sure he could get the ball rolling quite nicely. And, as we know, Mongoose already has a license to publish B5 novels and is using it.

2. What does it matter who publishes? If Mongoose would publish it, more power to them. If, as you say, there aren't enough people interested in Crusade novels to tempt a giant publisher, why not go with a little publisher? I doubt JMS will ever work with those guys anyway, but I can dream...

 

[KoshN]

1. I didn't mean for someone else to write it. I want JMS to write it. He's written novels before, so why not now?

He hasn't written novels in the B5 universe. I don't think he's comfortable writing novels, and in the B5 universe, he instead writes scripts.

It would be the next best thing to having a multi-year show produced (maybe even better). I know JMS doesn't own the license, but if he really wanted to write some Crusade novels, I'm sure he could get the ball rolling quite nicely. And, as we know, Mongoose already has a license to publish B5 novels and is using it.

Why don't you ask JMS this question over at rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated? I bet he either doesn't answer or comes up with a reason why he wouldn't write the novels, and why he wouldn't write them for Mongoose.

2. What does it matter who publishes? If Mongoose would publish it, more power to them. If, as you say, there aren't enough people interested in Crusade novels to tempt a giant publisher, why not go with a little publisher? I doubt JMS will ever work with those guys anyway, but I can dream...

The publisher pays the author to write the novels, and Mongoose wouldn't pay JMS enough to be interested in doing it. Mongoose is paying actors to write non-canon B5 novels. JMS wants nothing to do with those novels or Mongoose.

 

[RMcD]

Hey, maybe the Star Wreck: In the Pirkinning guys would be up for doing a Crusade revival..? Okay, it might be in Finnish, and it might take them 5 years to make each episode, but at least it'd have great effects Just a random thought.. My point is that virtual sets and B5-quality effects aren't so expensive to do that they're completely beyond the reach of ordinary people anymore (although of course you still need talent and a lot of time).

 

[darth_librarian]

I loved Crusade, but at the moment JMS needs to focus on a revival based around the core elements in B5. If the DVD series is success, I'm sure he will get around to Crusade, the Telepath War, and even tying up some of the loose ends in Rangers, as well as some new stories...

If its an issue for us, imagine how it must be for him.

Actually, does anyone have a master list of all outstanding B5 plot points? That would be cool...

And that new logo really has me pumped.

 

[Sindatur]

I loved Crusade, but at the moment JMS needs to focus on a revival based around the core elements in B5. If the DVD series is success, I'm sure he will get around to Crusade, the Telepath War, and even tying up some of the loose ends in Rangers, as well as some new stories...

If its an issue for us, imagine how it must be for him.

Actually, does anyone have a master list of all outstanding B5 plot points? That would be cool...

And that new logo really has me pumped.

I tthink that's pretty much it, as far as mysteries opened and not explored due to infant mortalities, other than where exactly he was going with the Hand. Many of us would've liked to have seen or read about G'Kar and Lytas travels, and many of us would've liked to have seen Valen's Shadow War and Sakai reunion with him (if it did indeed happen), but, those aren't really something he ever promised us, or that are neccessarily needed

 

[Galahad]

I was reading a little in between the lines on the JMS link posted in the other thread. He was offered the opportunity to do a feature but declined out of respect for the fairly recent passed actors, Richard Biggs and Andreas Katsulas.

I also think it makes better business sense to lay foundations first. To come out of nowhere with a B5 feature with little exposition after so much time has passed, could potentially cause executives to lose faith in the product (if it didn't perform commercially). To do a series of one off features that bring the visual aspect of B5 in line with modern CGI, whets peoples appetite for what could be possible both in terms of writing and production values and it helps the established fan base to wake up, smell the coffee and spread the word again.

 

[darth_librarian]

I was reading a little in between the lines on the JMS link posted in the other thread. He was offered the opportunity to do a feature but declined out of respect for the fairly recent passed actors, Richard Biggs and Andreas Katsulas.

I also think it makes better business sense to lay foundations first. To come out of nowhere with a B5 feature with little exposition after so much time has passed, could potentially cause executives to lose faith in the product (if it didn't perform commercially). To do a series of one off features that bring the visual aspect of B5 in line with modern CGI, whets peoples appetite for what could be possible both in terms of writing and production values and it helps the established fan base to wake up, smell the coffee and spread the word again.

Totally agree. The movie thing is an odd one. I hope it comes to pass in time, but by that time B5 has earned the budget it needs and the storyline it needs to shine.
JMS is also being cunning with the budget. Sets and CGI assets for any movie will need to be done from scratch, so why not aquire them in stages?The current model seems to create a good road to this.

 

[RMcD]

It does make sense to try to build up momentum again before doing something big like a theatrical movie. But it would certainly help if TLT was actually publicly broadcast.. otherwise it may in effect just be preaching to the converted..

 

[TJGuitar85]

It does make sense to try to build up momentum again before doing something big like a theatrical movie. But it would certainly help if TLT was actually publicly broadcast.. otherwise it may in effect just be preaching to the converted..

there's no reason why they wouldn't be on, say, sci fi channel, assuming they still have the b5 broadcast rights. If not, WB, can probably license it to any channel.

Cartoon Network showed all of the marvel comics direct-to-dvd animated features on tv, DirecTV's freeview channel often shows DVD concerts to promote their dvd releases. It wouldn't make sense to simply release these and not show them on tv to promote it.

 

[Sindatur]

there's no reason why they wouldn't be on, say, sci fi channel, assuming they still have the b5 broadcast rights. If not, WB, can probably license it to any channel.

Cartoon Network showed all of the marvel comics direct-to-dvd animated features on tv, DirecTV's freeview channel often shows DVD concerts to promote their dvd releases. It wouldn't make sense to simply release these and not show them on tv to promote it.

Unless of course no network was willing to pay for them, as is currently the case. WB has not yet made a deal with anyone, they would like to, but, so far no one has pony'ed up the cash.

 

[TJGuitar85]

Unless of course no network was willing to pay for them, as is currently the case. WB has not yet made a deal with anyone, they would like to, but, so far no one has pony'ed up the cash.

Then they might just have to lower their asking price. Any $$ WB gets from showing this on TV is just a bonus to what it will sell when all the fans buy it. If it gets good ratings, they can sell future installments to the cable channels for more $$