Doctor Who Series 6

[Sindatur]

It's what Moffatt himself refers to it as.... and wvery one on Twitter seems to call it that too. If it is a season then of course it must be Summer... because it is sooo short.

Interesting I wasn't aware of that, thanks

Surprised no one complained about that, after all the complaining about the Americanization (Or pandering to Americans if you prefer) of the show regarding the burning of the body in the first episode with Gasoline, rather Petrol. Heh, some folks complain about the silliest of things.

 

[A_M_Swallow]

Surprised no one complained about that, after all the complaining about the Americanization (Or pandering to Americans if you prefer) of the show regarding the burning of the body in the first episode with Gasoline, rather Petrol. Heh, some folks complain about the silliest of things.

That is definitely a silly thing to complain about. The scene is set in the USA and the gasoline is brought by an American FBI agent. The American word would be used.

 

[vacantlook]

So, with the Memorial Day week break, it totally threw me off last week when they came back, and that resulted in me totally forgetting about the show last week until it was like at least half over. So, I decided to wait to watch the repeat before tonight's new episode (thank you BBCAmerica for repeating the previous week's episode before each week's new episode, that's very kind of you).

I've definitely enjoyed the episodes, both last week's conclusion and this week's new episode. But I really, really feel like I've got to watch them again to get the most out of them. There's just so much stuff happening in them that I feel like not all of it sinks in as I watch it.

 

[Jade Jaguar]

VL, do you have OnDemand with your cable? I've been watching the eps on OnDemand, and there are no commercials, no annoying animated bugs, no breaks. But, the new eps are usually posted one week after regular broadcast.

 

[Sindatur]

I enjoyed it, the Doctor was very dark and angry, definitely can see where the Valleyard eventually comes from.

I was concerned seeing all the theories of River is Amy's daughter, that it I would hate it, if it came to pass. Perhaps because I had time to prepare for the revelation, but, I didn't dislike it anywhere near as much as I thought I would, it was handled very well. Still seems somehow incestuous a little, for the Doctor and River to be romantically involved, though.

Loved seeing the Doctor building up his army, Rory's encounter with the Cybermen (and the rest of his awesome moments). Strax and the Silurian were both really cool too. Nice "Fool me twice" moment with the babyGanger, didn't see that coming.

Oh, and there's a bunch of Rory "Chuck Norris" jokes going around now, some of them very funny.

Rory's so badass, his sperm makes daughters that can make a Dalek piss itself, LOL

 

[vacantlook]

JJ, nope, I don't have OnDemand.

Nice summary, Sindatur.

I loved the build up of the Doctor's assault force. And I was totally surprised by Amy telling Melody, "he's known as the Last Centurion". I, of course, was expecting her to say "the Doctor", so that ended up making Rory's entrance/scene with the Cybermen extra awesome.

With so many already guessing that River was Amy's baby going into the episode, I was concerned that if that ended up being the way things played out that they wouldn't be as emotional as I would want. I was worried that I would feel a bit of been-there-done-that over it, but I didn't. I loved the revelation of River being Amy's daughter.

The only thing I would say as a complaint, if it can be called that, is that the motivation for the army working against the Doctor wasn't as clear or prominently explained as I would've liked it.

 

[jnk5y]

I've been noticing a theme for the last few years of the show. The Doctor hates violence and thinks of himself as a guy who goes around saving people but he ends up making the friends he comes into contact with a fighting force. Davros showed the Doctor at the end of season 4 how each of his companions has now become a soldier willing to kill. It continued with the Pandorica and how the Doctor's enemies see him. And now they show how the people the Doctor saves see him. They are definitely building to something with this.

 

[vacantlook]

The Doctor's dislike of violence yet his effectively warrior-izing those who he befriends is a very intriguing theme; I can definitely understand why they'd want to continue exploring it in the show.

 

[Galahad]

BBC has confirmed that there will be no 2012 series... only a Christmas special. I suspect you can thank the Olympics and The Diamond Jubilee for that, to some degree.

There's a hope that maybe they are storing up a bit of cash to do something major for the 50th anniversary in 2013. Let's hope so... because at the moment the BBC is being the proverbial turkey voting for Christmas.

 

[Sindatur]

BBC has confirmed that there will be no 2012 series... only a Christmas special. I suspect you can thank the Olympics and The Diamond Jubilee for that, to some degree.

There's a hope that maybe they are storing up a bit of cash to do something major for the 50th anniversary in 2013. Let's hope so... because at the moment the BBC is being the proverbial turkey voting for Christmas.

Are you sure about that? What I've heard is Second part of this series, roundabout Sept/Oct, then Christmas Special, than half a series in 2012 + Christmas Special and then the other half of next series in 2013. Also seems to be connected to a Studio move and an offhand remark mentioned Moffat needs to sleep (Full Dr Who Series and Sherlock too heavy a burden with the Studio move timing?)

 

[vacantlook]

Well, "Let's Kill Hitler" is fun.

 

[A_M_Swallow]

Mels's life as described does not make sense. I suspect that a lot of the details are going to get filled in over the coming episodes.

Florida to being an orphan in a small English via New York is quite a journey. Some one guided her.

 

[rjb]

Well, "Let's Kill Hitler" is fun.

Agreed :thumbsup:. I thought it was a fantastic episode - and there was so much there that connected with previous episodes (if we've been paying attention ). And great to see a certain little girl again (aged a year or so and quite a bit more confident/assertive as a character, I thought). Very impressive how Steven Moffat has woven so many threads together so wonderfully. I felt it showed how well-thought-out the details of his whole story are. (And I immediately started the episode again - haven't done that with many programmes! - because I thought it was so good.)

 

[vacantlook]

There was a good bit of death humor in the episode. "You will be fine for 22 minutes; you will die in 23." (Or whatever the specific numbers were.) Or the antibodies: "You will experience a tingling sensation and then death."

One thing I thought was provoking was the new information we learned about the Silence.

 

[Galahad]

I thought it was an excellent episode... I did find my interest wandering a little in the middle... but aside from that, great fun.

I loved the foreshadowing with Mels driving the car through the word "Doctor". Some people are getting a little bit too hung up on the lack of involvement by Hitler (there's a phrase I thought I'd NEVER say lol), but I disagree... it was never going to be about him, and I'm certainly not worried how he got out of the cupboard!!!

You could argue that The Doctor sparked off World War 2 with this episode... by telling Hitler the British were coming, in 1938; he could have influenced the way Hitler played Neville Chamberlain during negotiations... or convinced him that the peace treaty wasn't worth upholding because The British were going to come after him anyway (yes... fiction I know... but fun to speculate about it in the fictional context).

Does this mean River is the Astronaut? Curious that she is intent on assassinating the Doctor after she had chronologically speaking already done it. Technically you could argue that it's the programming/conditioning of Madame Kovarian and The Silence that is to blame for that if she is the astronaut... but then remember the trick Moffat played last year with the Pandorica opening in The Big Bang to reveal not The Doctor as we had been led to believe... but Amy. He tricked The Doctor twice the same way... will he try and do it to us?

Really interested in working out how the Church evolves in all this. They've clearly been infiltrated by The Silence as at the time of Demon's Run, but by the time of Octavian it would seem they are somewhat gravitating away from that darkness.

 

[vacantlook]

I actually think it's great that the episode barely had anything to do with Hitler. It's far more about the theme, born out of that question we purveyers of science ficiton have encountered before, if we had time travel, would we try to change the future by going back in time and killing people like Hitler. I think we might have seen some of Mels's brainwashing in the quick scenes in class in which she objected to her teachers over both the Titanic and Hitler being as bad as they were because the Doctor didn't prevent it. We might have seen that the Silence used our inherent desire to right horrible wrongs and save people to make Mels blame the Doctor, and thus want to kill him. It would tie into the word "doctor" meaning warrior in the language of the Gamma Forest. I don't think the show could truly do Hilter justice if they focused on him in a serious way, so being almost flippant over it works much better, in my opinion.

I do think we're being led down a false road about the identity of who shot and killed the doctor at the beginning of "The Impossible Astronaut". I've been suspecting it for a while the more I rewatch the first half of the season. Moffat does seem to enjoy the reversal reveal. We also got it with the Silence. Last season we thought it was just a spooky saying, and then we get aliens that we're left identifying as the Silence, and now we're told that no, they're not it, just part of it. I don't know really who to think it is now that killed the Doctor, but I really doubt that it was River.

 

[Jade Jaguar]

I've believed that River, son of Amy and Rory, was the child astronaut for quite a while, and posted as much here, some time ago. How did River, offspring of two humans, get the ability to regenerate like a Time Lord? Could The Silence, or The Church have done it? I think not. I think that the reason the child astronaut killed the Dr. was to absorb his Time Lord spirit, so she could save him later, in the ep we just saw.

VL, I agree with your analysis of Mel's behavior in school. At the beginning, with her pulling a gun on the Dr., shooting in the Tardis, her behavior in general, I didn't like her character one bit. She seemed quite unsuitable, and someone the Dr. would not have put up with. But, when we find out who she really is, it all makes sense, and I liked it.

 

[vacantlook]

I think the Doctor put up with Mels at first the way he did out of respect to Amy and Rory for her being their friend. If the two of them hadn't been closely connected, I don't think he would have been as accomidating.

So far, the explanation for River being "human plus time lord" is that she was conceived while the tardis was zipping through time. The Doctor told lizard lady that the time lords became what they are/were due to exposure to the time vortex, and it's been presented, again so far at least, that River just sort of got a extra high dossage of exposure at conception. And it fundamentally altered her DNA, as revealed by the Church's bio scans of Baby Melody at Demon's Run.

River was the child astronaut; what I'm saying is that I don't think it was River the child astronaut that was in the astronaut suit that killed the Doctor. If it was, then Mels wouldn't have been out to kill the Doctor as she would have already done so earlier in her own timeline when she was still the child astronaut before she had regenerated into Mels. As adult Mels wouldn't have felt the need to pursue the Doctor to kill him as she would remember having already killed him.

 

[Sindatur]

Ever since the first episode of the season aired, and we watch the Doctor being killed by the Spacesuit, I've had a feeling that it was done specifically to "steal" or voluntarily give his regeneration energy to the Spacesuit being. I'm not sure how things could be sorted out that it was to give the energy to first of second regeneration River.

Curious thing, though, IIRC, didn't the regenerating youngster say I'm sorry, right before regenerating? Could be apologizing for killing the Doctor.

We have 2 obvious possibilities for how the Doctor survives: Ganger Doctor survived and is the one killed, or the Tesselact ship, massquerading as the Doctor (It was left behind, and the TARDIS can materialize inside of it - TARDIS was nowhere in sight during the Doctor's execution in the first episode). Problem with the Tesselact ship, though, could it be burned up and appear to be a Time Lord body?

And, of course, there are probably many other possibilities that aren't quite so obvious. I'm really loving this Series.

Oh, and VL, I very much agree with your thoughts about the title and Mels' possible conditioning in school.

 

[vacantlook]

Ok, here's a new thought I had during my shower just now. A variation on JJ's thesis: maybe the astronaut that shot and killed the doctor was River, who did absorb the regeneration energy, but not child astronaut River. We know the suit was a life support unit, maybe adult River got injured in a story we haven't gotten yet, and the Doctor put her in the suit, and then, knowing the date of his death from the file he got from the tesselact ship, he and adult River arrange for her to kill him and take the energy to save her from dying.

We know River ends up in prison for killing the Doctor, but despite the killing attempt in "Let's Kill Hitler", she's not in prison at the end. That would suggest that she, in her own timeline, hasn't killed him yet. So, it couldn't have been her in her child astronaut form that killed him at the beginning of "The Impossible Astronaut".