Interesting BSG Interview / Really Bad Hair

[Recoil]

I stumbled across and interesting interview of Ronald D Moore, creator of Battlestar Galactica. The interview is interesting. Contains spoilers of the Season 3 Finale, but if you have seen up to and including that, then you aren't at risk of learning anything beyond that, so don't worry.

Ronald D Moore Interview

Also I really have to say, and I have thought this for a few years now, that RDM has some really, REALLY bad hair. Dude, seriously. While I have never been a fan of the "Byron Mullet" to begin with, that hair is way, way, WAY, out of style. I find it hard to take a person seriously who goes around with a lions mane like that...

 

[darth_librarian]

Wonder if that was a stock photo. Seriously though, i thought hair like that was banned outside of Vegas under UN law.

 

[GKarsEye]

And that's one of the things that appealed to me about it the most—the fact that it would upset the idea of what Galactica was, and the things you thought you were comfortable knowing. Which is really what I like about the show, that it continues to push the envelope and that it never lets the audience settle into a comfortable routine.

That's all very nice, Ron, but those kind of "left turns" should at least make some kind of sense relating to stuff that happened before.

If I wanted pointless "twists" with no rhyme or reason, I'd still be watching 24.

 

[Boxie]

What an interesting interview, huh? I thought that part about Starbuck's death was very cool! Thanks for the link, Recoil!

.... Okaaaay, short straw tells him about the hair. We can't let him just walk around like that!

 

[vacantlook]

I'm surprised that the cast all thought Starbuck truly was killed off. When I watched that episode, the instant the explosion happened and characters were boo-hooing, I couldn't help but to roll my eyes and say, "She's not dead, duh." Her return was always a matter of when, and so it wasn't a surprise to me at all to see her again, and I felt extremely little emotion over the "death" when it happened.

 

[Recoil]

Agreed. Its like they put all this effort into making it a surprise, but no one bought that she really died in the first place. They may have gone to great lengths to keep the secret, but IMO they blew it in the execution of her death --- no one bought it.

 

[darth_librarian]

No one really dies in sc-fi. Ever.

 

[Chilli]

That's all very nice, Ron, but those kind of "left turns" should at least make some kind of sense relating to stuff that happened before.

If I wanted pointless "twists" with no rhyme or reason, I'd still be watching 24.

Once again, I wish more TV show producers would spend more time analysing B5 (at least for the first three seasons, before JMS had to make compromises on structure) as of how to tell an ever-changing show in a TV format.

I mean .. compare the enviroment of B5 from the beginning of the third season to the end of the third season.

Mid first season to beginning of the second season.

Or whatever.

Yet, it always makes *sense*. You can always see how and why the story got to where it is - why the earthforce captain guy and that weird alien ambassador are suddenly war lords, and shagging and the such. While on BSG, whenever they have any big development .. it's "eh? When did this happen? huh?"

Aargh, one of these days I'll learn to accept that B5 was my one true love, and that no subsequent flirtation with any other show can ever measure up to it ...

I'm surprised that the cast all thought Starbuck truly was killed off. When I watched that episode, the instant the explosion happened and characters were boo-hooing, I couldn't help but to roll my eyes and say, "She's not dead, duh." Her return was always a matter of when, and so it wasn't a surprise to me at all to see her again, and I felt extremely little emotion over the "death" when it happened.

Yeah .. with the track record the show has of actually dealing with the consequences of the grand OOMPHs they hand out, I had no doubt she would be back. My first reaction to her death was wondering how lame the cop-out will be.

*Chilli is grumpy today, and should be sleeping*

No one really dies in sc-fi. Ever.

Depends on the franchise really - if it's a franchise that attempts to stick to moderately altered laws of physics (Firefly), a franchise that attempts to stick to completely inverted laws of physics (Star Trek), or a franchise that uses mythological elements and shows/accepts powers that are too grand for humans to understand (B5). In the latter two categories .. yeah, dead doesn't mean much.

IN the first category, I would expect dead to just mean dead, and prior to Starbuck's demise, I had put BSG into that category. With the exception of the Cylon-copout, which was always possible.

 

[GKarsEye]

The frustrating thing to me about BSG is that they didn't even necessarily have to map out the whole structure for it all to make sense- they could've just figured out the backstory (ie, how Earth relates to the colonies and "lords of Kobol" and maybe some Big Secret about how the Cylons fit into all of it) and improvised the rest. While it's possible that they did do that, it just doesn't feel that way as of now.

 

[LondosHair]

He either needs a "Winger" t-shirt or he's the clone of one of the guys from Credence Clearwater Revival.

 

[KoshFan]

Agreed. Its like they put all this effort into making it a surprise, but no one bought that she really died in the first place. They may have gone to great lengths to keep the secret, but IMO they blew it in the execution of her death --- no one bought it.

My thoughts at the time exactly. I think my precise words were, "They took such care to hide it from everyone, and then they went and blew it in their own script!"

That's all very nice, Ron, but those kind of "left turns" should at least make some kind of sense relating to stuff that happened before.

Well, in a way we're spoiled by a guy who had it all plotted out five years ahead of time, and I in particular have been spoiled by a guy who can take a character intended to be a one-off villain and build a four-season redemption arc around him. And we all understand the demands of the medium... why bother writing backstory and why bother plotting out the next four seasons if there's no guarantee that you'll still be on the air in a week? But Chilli's still absolutely right; more writers need to take a page from the JMS/JW school of thought and begin plotting things out well ahead of time so they can foreshadow properly.

As it is, I have to wonder if RDM and the folks who run Lost think of Chekov only as Walter Koenig's character, and pay no attention to the writer and his sound advice about guns on walls.

 

[GKarsEye]

Well, in a way we're spoiled by a guy who had it all plotted out five years ahead of time, and I in particular have been spoiled by a guy who can take a character intended to be a one-off villain and build a four-season redemption arc around him. And we all understand the demands of the medium... why bother writing backstory and why bother plotting out the next four seasons if there's no guarantee that you'll still be on the air in a week? But Chilli's still absolutely right; more writers need to take a page from the JMS/JW school of thought and begin plotting things out well ahead of time so they can foreshadow properly.

Again, a writer doesn't need to plot the whole story arc to have it makes sense, just the back story should be enough.

 

[Alluveal]

Fans have asked Ron Moore over and over if it's ever watched B5 (some comparing Maelstrom to Z'Ha'Dum.) He claims to have never watched B5. The thing is, when he gets his long term story arcs right, they're awesome, but I would think that a storyteller such as Moore would always look to other sources for inspiration. I don't know if JMS watches any other sci-fi on television, but JMS seems more well-rounded in a sense.

 

[Recoil]

I don't think Malestrom in any way is similar to Z'Ha'Dum. The only thing remotely similar is one of the hero's "Dies" in the episode and comes back a few episodes later.

Sorry folks, but that isn't nearly enough to call them similar, or ask the creator if he ever watched B5.

I don't think the two episodes are alike at all. Different feel, structure, story, everything. Apples and oranges...

 

[darth_librarian]

Z'Ha'Dum draws some obvious plot points from The Fellowship of the Ring, but they way it is structured, and given the title, its obviously more of a homeage of sorts. It was a perfect mid-point in a closely plotted arc, and gave a satisfactory conclusion to three years of plotting, before the networks mangled things up a bit for JMS.

Malestorm was an attempt at investigating the psyche of a single character, with a tacky ending that no-one brought added on. No similiarity at all.

That siad, I loved the two part finale of BSG S-3, Watchtower and all.... Whilst I loved B5 for its structure, I also love BSG for the way it changes tack and focus all of a sudden. In many ways, its lack of obvious structure is its selling point, and provides a nice juxtaposition to B5 in that respect.

RDM did good plotting in DS9. Let him do his thing in BSG. He only has 13 episodes left. But he does need a new stylist. My purple Night Elf druid in World of Warcraft has more style.

 

[Chilli]

I didn't always have the feeling with DS9 that they always completely knew where they were going .. but the way they did it on DS9 though, it was absolutely fine with me. Not every show can be B5, and DS9 was awesome enough without trying to be.

The characters' developments generally made sense (aside from the whole Worf/Dax thing. I could have strangled the writers for that), and they didn't generally pull things out of their butts that they couldn't handle. Their strong characters stayed strong, and were still cool after 7 years .. while BSG has by now killed my interest in anyone but Laura at this point.

Unless, of course, the X years since I've seen DS9 have given me too rosy a memory. I'll be getting to DS9 in the course of my grand Trek rewatching (currently halfway through season 5 of TNG) relatively soon - I'll let you know if I was wrong.

 

[Recoil]

Whilst I loved B5 for its structure, I also love BSG for the way it changes tack and focus all of a sudden. In many ways, its lack of obvious structure is its selling point, and provides a nice juxtaposition to B5 in that respect.

I agree. I liked the 2 part finale too, and your above quote is exactly how I feel about the show. While Season 3 seemed less interesting than the prior two, they redeemed things with the finale. I'm not convinced I'm 100% behind the changes with the 4 Cylons revealed, but I loved the character moments of them going back to work, and I think it will make Season 4 very interesting --- even if it wasn't planned out a year ago.

He only has 13 episodes left

I thought they extended next season to a full season after all. There are still rumors Season 4 may be the last, but I think its going to go a full 20.

 

[Chilli]

Recoil is correct. From wikipedia:

According to Scifi Wire, the Scifi Channel has ordered 22 episodes to be made for season four, (a number increased from 13 as originally announced). Production of the new season begins May 2007 and SciFi plans to begin airing in early 2008. The 22 episode order consists of 20 episodes which will form the fourth season and a special 2-hour movie primarily set on the Battlestar Pegasus which is planned to be shown in the fourth quarter of 2007.

 

[Alluveal]

I think people are comparing Maelstrom to Z'Ha'Dum in that the hero takes a leap of faith/a plunge a the end and descends into darkness (Sheridan into the chasm and Starbuck into the darkened eye.) That's what I got from it.

 

[darth_librarian]

Recoil is correct. From wikipedia:

I stand corrected! Rock on!! Is the Pegasus flashback direct to DVD movie going ahead? You know that is going to be brutal...