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My Centauri Trilogy Review *Slight Spoilers*
- Thread starter The_One
- Start date
vacantlook
Super Moderator
A pie in the oven? I didn't know KoshN was domestic! 
KoshN
Super Moderator
A pie in the oven? I didn't know KoshN was domestic!
KoshN was hungry for pumpkin pie. (I'm still going to eat it. Yes, it's obviously a lot too well done, but it still looks edible.)
If I wasn't afraid of ruining it
, I'd start my annual pork roast, now. Man, I'm really dragging. Got to get some more sleep. I'm on-call again in 2.5 hrs. Ugh!
vacantlook
Super Moderator
I've often found that overdone pumpkin pies are still edible once the top layer of overndoneness is removed.
vacantlook
Super Moderator
Enjoy. Sweet dreams.
B5_Obsessed
Regular
But Sheridan's realization of the Shadow strategy and his decision to muster the fleet, at great risk to his allies, was the turning point of the entire Shadow War. One of the great moments of the series is when Delenn returns to the council chamber to find it empty of all save one Drazi. It seems like the league has abandoned the cause, but then the lone Drazi tells her that the others are off mustering the fleet she and Sheridan has called for, and warning her that she better be right, because if she (Sheridan, really) is wrong, "it will cost us dearly!"
If Cavelos is right, then there was no risk in this at all, because they were all just unknowingly implementing Galen's strategy to defeat the Shadows, and he knew their plans. The heroism of Sheridan taking the risk, and the league backing his call simply because they realized he had established the moral authority tto make it was false and hollow, based on false premises. Since this was the decisive action that welded the future Interstellar Alliance, the Alliance was built on false premises as well. Blech!
sleepy_shadow
Regular
That is (more or less)... how the technomage trilogy described it.
I would however note... that Galen possessed no "strategy" to defeat the Shadows, merely a tactical hint, a single-occasion exploit... usable once. It was findable without him.
Shadow "strategy" on the other hand... was focused neither on defending Z'ha'dum (which non-redundancy in defenses, and latter events likewise, suggest they considered expendable)... nor efficiently trading their remote-controlled ships against ships manned by hundreds of sentients.
Neither was their goal maximum casualties. Before the occasion on Z'ha'dum, they clearly refrained from using strategic weapons.
Their self-admitted goal was chaos and evolution... which one should probably read as "breaking down hierarchies and power structures to allow rapid change". Unfortunately they cared little about the cost... about other creatures' tolerance for change... and not much about letting others choose direction.
For Shadows... planets and cities were probably not especially relevant. Whether casualties mattered to them... was doubtful, since they placed their goals above other creatures' lives... but their initial refrainment from causing mass destruction... suggests that life *somewhat* mattered to them.
Their own lives would proably matter more... but it remains doubtful how many Shadows the nuclear blast actually killed. In an extreme case... they might notice the first particles of the starting blast... or even the detonator working. They might think several thoughts before and during the acceleration of fusion...
...and when flow of particles would become unbearable, they might already have escaped. Either become transparent to key types of radiation... transmitted parts of their personality away to experience "only a body death"... dropped away from normal space, or taken other precautions to experience a "star dip".
A more difficult bit for them... might *not* be losing a city. Perhaps it would be... finding an alliance difficult to crack opposing them? An alliance where nobody answered their question, too many rejected their offers? That would leave them no pretense of "letting others choose" -- a pretense they wanted to maintain, even if only a pretense.
----------
Either way... much like Sheridan... Galen was going to Z'ha'dum without clear strategy. Merely in hope of accomplishing something... and though he did (fought his sworn enemy Elizar, conveniently obstructed Shadow defense systems)... he came back to a world where the Shadow war had switched to higher gear... and things were happening which a technomage could influence no more than ordinary humanoids.
Vorlons were seizing a long-unseen opportunity... while Shadows moved *much* faster than before, reactivating or building strategic weapons and mirroring the Vorlon strategy.
Galen could hardly be certain of finding Lorien on Z'ha'dum... of Sheridan stumbling there at same time... of having the chance to help destroying a Shadow city... even of successfully getting Elizar.
While it remained within the realm of prediction that provocation could escalate conflict... I doubt if escalating conflict beyond his own ability to influence would be a sane "strategy", so I prefer to think he had none. He was merely willing to die... do anything but passively watch.
I would however note... that Galen possessed no "strategy" to defeat the Shadows, merely a tactical hint, a single-occasion exploit... usable once. It was findable without him.
Shadow "strategy" on the other hand... was focused neither on defending Z'ha'dum (which non-redundancy in defenses, and latter events likewise, suggest they considered expendable)... nor efficiently trading their remote-controlled ships against ships manned by hundreds of sentients.
Neither was their goal maximum casualties. Before the occasion on Z'ha'dum, they clearly refrained from using strategic weapons.
Their self-admitted goal was chaos and evolution... which one should probably read as "breaking down hierarchies and power structures to allow rapid change". Unfortunately they cared little about the cost... about other creatures' tolerance for change... and not much about letting others choose direction.
For Shadows... planets and cities were probably not especially relevant. Whether casualties mattered to them... was doubtful, since they placed their goals above other creatures' lives... but their initial refrainment from causing mass destruction... suggests that life *somewhat* mattered to them.
Their own lives would proably matter more... but it remains doubtful how many Shadows the nuclear blast actually killed. In an extreme case... they might notice the first particles of the starting blast... or even the detonator working. They might think several thoughts before and during the acceleration of fusion...
...and when flow of particles would become unbearable, they might already have escaped. Either become transparent to key types of radiation... transmitted parts of their personality away to experience "only a body death"... dropped away from normal space, or taken other precautions to experience a "star dip".
A more difficult bit for them... might *not* be losing a city. Perhaps it would be... finding an alliance difficult to crack opposing them? An alliance where nobody answered their question, too many rejected their offers? That would leave them no pretense of "letting others choose" -- a pretense they wanted to maintain, even if only a pretense.
----------
Either way... much like Sheridan... Galen was going to Z'ha'dum without clear strategy. Merely in hope of accomplishing something... and though he did (fought his sworn enemy Elizar, conveniently obstructed Shadow defense systems)... he came back to a world where the Shadow war had switched to higher gear... and things were happening which a technomage could influence no more than ordinary humanoids.
Vorlons were seizing a long-unseen opportunity... while Shadows moved *much* faster than before, reactivating or building strategic weapons and mirroring the Vorlon strategy.
Galen could hardly be certain of finding Lorien on Z'ha'dum... of Sheridan stumbling there at same time... of having the chance to help destroying a Shadow city... even of successfully getting Elizar.
While it remained within the realm of prediction that provocation could escalate conflict... I doubt if escalating conflict beyond his own ability to influence would be a sane "strategy", so I prefer to think he had none. He was merely willing to die... do anything but passively watch.
KoshN
Super Moderator
All? Dell 1 thru 9, the three novelizations and the three Del Rey trilogies? ...or just the following?
Babylon 5 Book #7 - The Shadow Within (11/2256 - 01/2257)
Babylon 5 Book #9 - To Dream in the City of Sorrows (Marcus in 10/2260, recalling events of 1/2259-9/2260)
Dark Genesis - The Birth of the Psi Corps (2115-2189)
Deadly Relations - Bester Ascendant (2189-2258)
Final Reckoning - The Fate of Bester (2271-2281)
Legions of Fire - Book I - The Long Night of Centauri Prime (2262-2266)
Legions of Fire - Book II - Armies of Light and Dark (2266-2273)
Legions of Fire - Book III - Out of the Darkness (2274-2278)
The Passing of the Techno-Mages - Book I - Casting Shadows (11/2258-12/31/2258)
The Passing of the Techno-Mages - Book II - Summoning Light (1/2259-2/2259)
The Passing of the Techno-Mages - Book III - Invoking Darkness (8/2260-2261)
In the Beginning (Londo in 2278, recalling events of 2245-2247)
A Call to Arms - 12/2266-1/2267
Thirdspace - 5/2261
You should read "The Shadow Within" immediately before the first book of the Technomage trilogy ("Casting Shadows").
GKarsEye
Regular
Yes, those are the books I have and will re-read. I just need to buy a copy of Shadow Within to complete my collection of "canon" B5 books. I supposed I'd be interested in the other Del-Ray novels, but don't want to pay for them and store them, since I've heard they range from the absurd to the merely inconsequential.
Here, off the top of my head, is the narrative chronological order of the novels, assuming that Shadow Within is about the Icarus going to Z'ha Dum, IIRC:
1. Birth of the Psi Corps
2. Shadow Within
3. Bester Ascendant
4. 1st Technomage
5. Dream in the City of Sorrows
6. 2nd and 3rd Technomage
7. Centauri Trilogy
8. Last Bester book
The fact that I don't have Shadow Within and am already half-way into the first Psi Corps means I won't actually do this. Also not sure if I will re-read Technomages. Probably not, as I do want to get back to reading real books.
Here, off the top of my head, is the narrative chronological order of the novels, assuming that Shadow Within is about the Icarus going to Z'ha Dum, IIRC:
1. Birth of the Psi Corps
2. Shadow Within
3. Bester Ascendant
4. 1st Technomage
5. Dream in the City of Sorrows
6. 2nd and 3rd Technomage
7. Centauri Trilogy
8. Last Bester book
The fact that I don't have Shadow Within and am already half-way into the first Psi Corps means I won't actually do this. Also not sure if I will re-read Technomages. Probably not, as I do want to get back to reading real books.
RW7427
Super Moderator
Well, since I work two jobs, spend too much time on the computer, and have a habit of reading more than one book at once in the little time I do have for reading, it's been a slow go finishing that one. I'm reading a Dragonlance series at the same time as the Psi Corp book.
I'm going quite slowly through the Technomage Trilogy too - I think I just about passed the half-way point in the first book. But; I'm really enjoying it now the plot is beginning to emerge, and things are hotting up
Still, it's not quite as addictive as the Centauri trilogy, which I gobbled up pretty quickly!
Still, it's not quite as addictive as the Centauri trilogy, which I gobbled up pretty quickly!
