Named Vorlons?

[KoshFan]

If memory serves we see a grand total of three Volrons in the series. Kosh, Ulkesh and whoever speaks for them at Corriana 6.

Regards,

Joe

That and the Vorlon in Lyta's flashback vision.

In In the Beginning, Ulkesh seems to defer to Kosh, which makes me think that Kosh outranked him, but it may just have been that Kosh was older, and Ulkesh was deferring to his elder.

I always interpreted that as Ulkesh being more aloof, and letting the "soft" Kosh do the talking. (Also, I may be imagining it, but I always though Kosh shot Ulkesh a look when Ulkesh took a harsher tone with Delenn.)

 

[KoshN]

That and the Vorlon in Lyta's flashback vision.

In Lyta's flashback, when she's in the tank, we see two Vorlons in the reflection. The one in the foreground looks like Ulkesh, and the one in the background looks like Kosh. They're in the lower left corner of the frame.

 

[KoshFan]

Ooops. Been a while since I'd seen that one.

 

[KoshN]

Ooops. Been a while since I'd seen that one.

I remembered it because it was in my Laserdisc (full screen) vs. Sci-Fi airing (widescreen) comparison from the episode Secrets of the Soul.

Look at those two peepers, ogling another peeper.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

In In the Beginning, Ulkesh seems to defer to Kosh, which makes me think that Kosh outranked him, but it may just have been that Kosh was older, and Ulkesh was deferring to his elder.

I suspect it was more a matter of Kosh have the greater interest in/knowledge of the Younger Races in general and the Minbari in particular (going back to Valen and the previous war) and Ulkesh being content to let Kosh take the lead in getting them to do what needed to be done. That and a snobbish reluctance to deal to directly with such inferior beings. Less a question of deference or respect than, "It's your dog, you train it and just make sure it doesn't ruin my carpet."

Regards,

Joe

 

[Galahad]

That and the Vorlon in Lyta's flashback vision.



I always interpreted that as Ulkesh being more aloof, and letting the "soft" Kosh do the talking. (Also, I may be imagining it, but I always though Kosh shot Ulkesh a look when Ulkesh took a harsher tone with Delenn.)

I definitely remember Ulkesh cutting Kosh daggers (or at least that's how it felt), when kosh told Delenn "The truth points to itself".

It's as if Ulkesh understood and respected that the war had to end the way it did (in order for the timeline to happen the way it did)... but took the view that the vorlons should sit back and let the/minbari realise it without interference.

Don't forget that the vorlons would not be aware that Kosh had been the instigator for Delenn's realisation because sinclair (their source for the unfolding of events) was not privy to that exchange.

 

[Elipsis]

I'm catching a vibe here that Kosh's encounter suit is "dressing down" for his position compared to the one Ulkesh wears.

Where did you guys pull this from?

 

[KoshN]

I'm catching a vibe here that Kosh's encounter suit is "dressing down" for his position compared to the one Ulkesh wears.

Where did you guys pull this from?

Dressing down? No. I just think Kosh's encounter suit is older, and that Kosh is older as well.

 

[GaribaldisHair]

Ulkesh's purple encounter suit puts him right in the heart of Drazi politics. Kosh just wanted to remain neutral.

 

[Galahad]

Dressing down? No. I just think Kosh's encounter suit is older, and that Kosh is older as well.

If we accept he was one of the two vorlons accompanying Valen on B4 in WWE2 Kosh had a purple encounter suit during that time and must have adopted a new outward appearance following this... possibly reflecting a change in him as a consequence of his interactions with Sinclair.

 

[KoshFan]

JMS has always strongly implied that Kosh was heavily influenced by Valen.

 

[RW7427]

That's probably why he was the one to remind the Minbari of the prophecy given by Valen of the next Shadow war.

 

[KoshFan]

Well, the Minbari remembered it on their own, or at least the Rangers did -- remember the Anla'shok'na in In the Beginning? He urged the Gray Council to start gearing up for war and pleaded to recontact the Vorlons before he knew that Dukhat had two of them in his chambers.

 

[RW7427]

Oh yeah, you're right!

 

[RMcD]

The Vorlon seen briefly with Rathenn on Minbar in War Without End pt1 - I assume then that's Ulkesh in his ambassadorial role, despite his translator flashing differently? I was never sure if that was supposed to be him or a random Vorlon..

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

The Vorlon seen briefly with Rathenn on Minbar in War Without End pt1 - I assume then that's Ulkesh in his ambassadorial role, despite his translator flashing differently? I was never sure if that was supposed to be him or a random Vorlon..

Yes, that's Ulkesh. It is clear from To Dream in the City of Sorrows that only two Vorlons have visited Minbar in modern times, Kosh and Ulkesh, and that Ulkesh is the one who remains when Kosh goes to Babylon 5. I hadn't noticed his translator flashing differently. Maybe he's wearing a Vorlon-to-Minbari model and switches to Vorlon-to-English when he goes to B5.

Regards,

Joe