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Scarecrow and Captain Kirk
- Thread starter Joseph DeMartino
- Start date
hypatia
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
Nah. If overacting were actually a criminal offense, Shatner would have gotten The Chair years ago.
Regards,
Joe
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Have any of you ever seen the movie “Judgment at Nuremburg”? There are many great actors giving fantastic performances in that movie. Shatner’s acting is very different in that movie. If anything, he’s reserved (which his character would be under the circumstances). So I’m afraid I have to say the “over the top” is put on FOR Star Trek.
Sorry, folks, but you have to blame the director under these circumstances. When an actor can be perfectly subtle in one piece, and constantly over-the-top in another, it’s the director, you can bet.
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
Nah. If overacting were actually a criminal offense, Shatner would have gotten The Chair years ago.
Regards,
Joe
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Have any of you ever seen the movie “Judgment at Nuremburg”? There are many great actors giving fantastic performances in that movie. Shatner’s acting is very different in that movie. If anything, he’s reserved (which his character would be under the circumstances). So I’m afraid I have to say the “over the top” is put on FOR Star Trek.
Sorry, folks, but you have to blame the director under these circumstances. When an actor can be perfectly subtle in one piece, and constantly over-the-top in another, it’s the director, you can bet.
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
GKarsEye
Regular
Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree with Joe on Shatner's over-acting. Want proof: both of his Twiliht Zone appearances:
1) The plane. Duh. "There's...something...out there!"
2) He encounters a fortune telling machine that's always right. "How...does it...know?!"
I saw him in a movie version of the Brothers Karimazov. He played the quite religious brother, so he didn't do much. The other, more interesting brother was played by the bald guy who was the Pharoah in the Ten Commandments. It was quite a contrast.
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"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
1) The plane. Duh. "There's...something...out there!"
2) He encounters a fortune telling machine that's always right. "How...does it...know?!"
I saw him in a movie version of the Brothers Karimazov. He played the quite religious brother, so he didn't do much. The other, more interesting brother was played by the bald guy who was the Pharoah in the Ten Commandments. It was quite a contrast.
------------------
"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
Mondo Londo
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GKarsEye:
Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree with Joe on Shatner's over-acting. Want proof: both of his Twilight Zone appearances:
1) The plane. Duh. "There's...something...out there!"
2) He encounters a fortune telling machine that's always right. "How...does it...know?!"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
He also had a role in the original Outer Limits, I think one of, if not his last role before TOS, wherein he played an astronaut who was effected by some alien he encountered.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>
I saw him in a movie version of the Brothers Karimazov. He played the quite religious brother, so he didn't do much. The other, more interesting brother was played by the bald guy who was the Pharoah in the Ten Commandments. It was quite a contrast.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yul Brenner.
Also danced with Deborah Kerr in The King and I; led the good guys against impossible odds in The Magnificent Seven; parodied his The Magnificent Seven role in West World; and who left to us those amazing "don't smoke" public service commercials, released immediately after he died of cancer -- among many others.
I too saw Judgement at Nuremburg. I remember Spencer Tracey and Marlene Dietrich, as well as Schell and Burt Lancaster. Shatner, I think, played a prosecutor? In all kindness, placed against the actors above, he didn't jump off the screen. Then again, who could?
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree with Joe on Shatner's over-acting. Want proof: both of his Twilight Zone appearances:
1) The plane. Duh. "There's...something...out there!"
2) He encounters a fortune telling machine that's always right. "How...does it...know?!"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
He also had a role in the original Outer Limits, I think one of, if not his last role before TOS, wherein he played an astronaut who was effected by some alien he encountered.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>
I saw him in a movie version of the Brothers Karimazov. He played the quite religious brother, so he didn't do much. The other, more interesting brother was played by the bald guy who was the Pharoah in the Ten Commandments. It was quite a contrast.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yul Brenner.
I too saw Judgement at Nuremburg. I remember Spencer Tracey and Marlene Dietrich, as well as Schell and Burt Lancaster. Shatner, I think, played a prosecutor? In all kindness, placed against the actors above, he didn't jump off the screen. Then again, who could?
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
Joseph DeMartino
Moderator
Hypatia:
I have seen Judgment at Nueremburg, several times. The odd thing is, I can't even remember Shatner being in it. When I think of the movie it is Lancaster, Schell and Garland who stand out for me.
But regarding the "director" business. Trek had dozens of directors over the 79 episodes and several movies. And Shatner has given similarly over-the-top perfomances in most of them. He's done the same in his other series and in a number of movies and TV shows I've seen him in.
So the odds are that this is his natural style and that Stanley Kramer managed to restrain him for Nuremeburg. A director's influence can cut both ways.
Regards,
Joe
------------------
Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net
I have seen Judgment at Nueremburg, several times. The odd thing is, I can't even remember Shatner being in it. When I think of the movie it is Lancaster, Schell and Garland who stand out for me.
But regarding the "director" business. Trek had dozens of directors over the 79 episodes and several movies. And Shatner has given similarly over-the-top perfomances in most of them. He's done the same in his other series and in a number of movies and TV shows I've seen him in.
So the odds are that this is his natural style and that Stanley Kramer managed to restrain him for Nuremeburg. A director's influence can cut both ways.
Regards,
Joe
------------------
Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net
hypatia
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
Hypatia:
I have seen Judgment at Nueremburg, several times. The odd thing is, I can't even remember Shatner being in it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
He didn't have a large role, but had many speaking lines and some import in a couple of scenes. I don't know law, so I can't name his position, but he seems to act like a clerk or personal aide to the judge (Spencer Tracy, the star of the film which you also don't mention). But he also swears in all of the witnesses.
Just wanted to point out that Shatner can give a subtle performance. No director is going to tell him to act markedly different in their episode than another. The Kirk character was over-the-top, I just think Shatner new it and played it like "Man From UNCLE".
I admit my favorite Shatner skit was the Saturday Night Live skit when he yells at a roomfull of trekkies "get a life! Move out of your parent's basement!"
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
Hypatia:
I have seen Judgment at Nueremburg, several times. The odd thing is, I can't even remember Shatner being in it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
He didn't have a large role, but had many speaking lines and some import in a couple of scenes. I don't know law, so I can't name his position, but he seems to act like a clerk or personal aide to the judge (Spencer Tracy, the star of the film which you also don't mention). But he also swears in all of the witnesses.
Just wanted to point out that Shatner can give a subtle performance. No director is going to tell him to act markedly different in their episode than another. The Kirk character was over-the-top, I just think Shatner new it and played it like "Man From UNCLE".
I admit my favorite Shatner skit was the Saturday Night Live skit when he yells at a roomfull of trekkies "get a life! Move out of your parent's basement!"
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
FlarnChef
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mondo Londo:
Yul Brenner.
Also danced with Deborah Kerr in The King and I; led the good guys against impossible odds in The Magnificent Seven; parodied his The Magnificent Seven role in West World; and who left to us those amazing "don't smoke" public service commercials, released immediately after he died of cancer -- among many others.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bravo!! Well said! Shatner in that old
classic....ooo what a frightening thought!
Like BB in, oh I don't know, Macbeth. Now
Shatner in Macbeth.....He'd eat the scenery!!!!!
But the idea of two space heroes in the
same movie could be interesting
------------------
"...abso-FRAGGIN-lutely, damn it! I have been studying your use of lauguage since our last discussion. Do you approve?"
Yul Brenner.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bravo!! Well said! Shatner in that old
classic....ooo what a frightening thought!
Like BB in, oh I don't know, Macbeth. Now
Shatner in Macbeth.....He'd eat the scenery!!!!!
But the idea of two space heroes in the
same movie could be interesting
------------------
"...abso-FRAGGIN-lutely, damn it! I have been studying your use of lauguage since our last discussion. Do you approve?"
Joseph DeMartino
Moderator
If they get the surviving Star Trek cast together, they could do Cocoon III.
Regards,
Joe
------------------
Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net
Regards,
Joe
------------------
Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net
Mondo Londo
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
If they get the surviving Star Trek cast together, they could do Cocoon III.
Regards,
Joe
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm not sure I'd trust them around any cocoons -- they might jump in and emerge as Minbari! Anything to steal a scene!
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
[This message has been edited by Mondo Londo (edited July 27, 2001).]
If they get the surviving Star Trek cast together, they could do Cocoon III.
Regards,
Joe
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm not sure I'd trust them around any cocoons -- they might jump in and emerge as Minbari! Anything to steal a scene!
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
[This message has been edited by Mondo Londo (edited July 27, 2001).]
GKarsEye
Regular
Did anyone ever see a movie called Enterprise? It stars Will from Will & Grace and has Shatner as himself. It's a silly comedy about a couple of Trekkies and their problems with women, or some such nonsense. Anyway, Shatner raps Shakespeare at the end, but the rapping is poorly dubbed. I pissed my pants.
------------------
"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
------------------
"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
Mondo Londo
Regular
I think we can all agree Shatner is someone who got the very most from his talents.
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"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
hypatia
Regular
Yes, it's a tough field to earn a living in, acting. Anyone who can earn a living from it must have captured many imaginations somehow! Not to mention, had a LOT of good luck.
I admit I wish the original captain could have stayed in the role. And the original first officer (a woman, in pants BTW, not those ridiculous mini skirts!)
But Spock smiled, didn't he? It's weird to watch "The Cage", and see that!
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
I admit I wish the original captain could have stayed in the role. And the original first officer (a woman, in pants BTW, not those ridiculous mini skirts!)
But Spock smiled, didn't he? It's weird to watch "The Cage", and see that!
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
Mondo Londo
Regular
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hypatia:
I admit I wish the original captain could have stayed in the role. And the original first officer (a woman, in pants BTW, not those ridiculous mini skirts!)
But Spock smiled, didn't he? It's weird to watch "The Cage", and see that!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
1. I think the powres that be wanted to replace Capt. Pike because he didn't come across as "action oriented" enough.
2. The original #1 was played by Majel Barrett (aka, Mrs. Roddenberry). The powers that be did not want a female XO. Majel Barrett was recast as nuse Christine Chapel; has been the voice of the ship/station computer for all Trek projects (as far as I know -- if she wasn't on the cartoon, or something, I'm willing to believe it); became Counselor Troi's mother; and had a role in season 1 of Earth: Final Conflict.
After Gene Roddenberry died, she called herself Majel Roddenberry.
3. The powers that be wanted to get rid of "the guy in the ears," too. Roddenberry held to his guns on that one, though. It did take a while for the prototypical Vulcan portrayal to formulate, though. In those early episodes, we can see Nimoy do all sorts of things that later "Vulcans don't do."
This isn't very surprising. I mentioned in a different thread that CC started the first few episodes trying to put a Russian cadence into her voice to play Ivanova.
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
I admit I wish the original captain could have stayed in the role. And the original first officer (a woman, in pants BTW, not those ridiculous mini skirts!)
But Spock smiled, didn't he? It's weird to watch "The Cage", and see that!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
1. I think the powres that be wanted to replace Capt. Pike because he didn't come across as "action oriented" enough.
2. The original #1 was played by Majel Barrett (aka, Mrs. Roddenberry). The powers that be did not want a female XO. Majel Barrett was recast as nuse Christine Chapel; has been the voice of the ship/station computer for all Trek projects (as far as I know -- if she wasn't on the cartoon, or something, I'm willing to believe it); became Counselor Troi's mother; and had a role in season 1 of Earth: Final Conflict.
After Gene Roddenberry died, she called herself Majel Roddenberry.
3. The powers that be wanted to get rid of "the guy in the ears," too. Roddenberry held to his guns on that one, though. It did take a while for the prototypical Vulcan portrayal to formulate, though. In those early episodes, we can see Nimoy do all sorts of things that later "Vulcans don't do."
This isn't very surprising. I mentioned in a different thread that CC started the first few episodes trying to put a Russian cadence into her voice to play Ivanova.
------------------
"What's up, Drakh?"
Michael Garibaldi
hypatia
Regular
Oh, yea, I knew all of that about Star Trek. Well, I've heard other rumors as to why the original captain was replaced, but yours is the one I tend to assume is true.
So I guess JMS is not the first, nor the last, writer/producer to have networks telling him what to do and what not to do.
Can ANYONE HERE imagine TOS of ST WITHOUT SPOCK! Horror or horrors!
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
So I guess JMS is not the first, nor the last, writer/producer to have networks telling him what to do and what not to do.
Can ANYONE HERE imagine TOS of ST WITHOUT SPOCK! Horror or horrors!
------------------
"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
Trek's most Egregious "replacement" was the first actor hired to play the Captain of Voyager. She quit after someone from wardrobe tried to explain that the Network Execs had specified that she had to wear a padded Bra to make her look "more womanly".
They let her out of the contract rather than endure the sort of bad publicity a fight over the incident would generate.
Talk about "Bonehead Manouvers".
------------------
Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?
They let her out of the contract rather than endure the sort of bad publicity a fight over the incident would generate.
Talk about "Bonehead Manouvers".
------------------
Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?
SwiftBiscuit
Regular
Moving this trek discussion to Other Shows...
