that dreaming ep of delenn's

[TheLick]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

Sinclair takes the triluminary back through the time rift. Zathras gives it to him.

*I think* /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[DaRkEnEdStAr]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

How do you know that ? How do you know the vorlons didn`t give it to him ?

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
How do you know the vorlons didn`t give it to him ?


[/quote]

Because JMS said that Zathras brought the triluminaries and the Chrysalis machine with him from Epsilon 3 in WWE part 1. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif (As noted above.)

Regards,

Joe

 

[GShans]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

and is shown in WWE pt 2.

 

[skyace]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

The Council consisted of the Leader, Dukhat, and "the Nine" But Delenn is told the Council is deadlocked as she cradles the dead Dukhat. You can't have a deadlock with nine voting members, so one or more of the council must also have been killed or incapcitated.

Hold on. At that time, Delenn had just been initiated into the council, so she would be one of the nine. That leaves 8 others, 4 for each. Wouldn't that make her the deciding vote?

That brings up another question. Who voted for/against a war with the humans? The 3 members of the Warrior caste were probably for it. So who was the other one?

well. i think that includes dukhat- who is now dead, leaving 7 living members and delenn.

therefore, a deadlock requires an additional odd number of members to have died.

 

[skyace]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

Hold on. At that time, Delenn had just been initiated into the council, so she would be one of the nine. That leaves 8 others, 4 for each. Wouldn't that make her the deciding vote?

Yes, in theory. But wasn't Dukhat also a member of the nine? He certainly can't have voted because he was ... erm ... otherwise engaged at the time. That leaves 8 including Delenn, so she couldn't be the deciding vote.

However, as Delenn proved in The Gathering, the Minbari are happy with the concept of abstention. We do not know the voting numbers only that they are deadlocked.

Perhaps the 3 Warrior Caste members voted for war, two Worker and the one remaining Religious Caste members voted against with the third Worker Caste member abstaining. That would be 3-all with one abstention.

The only remaining members are Dukhat and Delenn, which leaves Delenn effectively with the deciding vote.

Just my $0.02

<img src="/forums/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" />

didn't they refer to delenn's abstentation as "2 against or abstain", indicating that abstaining votes are lumped into against.

besides, a member of the GRAY COUNCIL- ruling body of the Minbari race or any race- should not be able to abstain on a vote for war in good conscience. imo, abstaining on something as serious as war implies some sort of lack of responsibility...

anyway, if they needed time, a motion to suspend the vote for a day could have been proposed.

 

[grumbler]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

Except that JMS said unambiguously

There's the One, and the Nine...when Dukhat was alive, there were 9 grey council members and him as the head of it, making ten. (Look at the picture and count the number of people.) 1 and 9.

 

[grumbler]

Re: that dreaming ep of delenn\'s

Also note that here he clarified the circles issue:

No, if you keep watching Dukhat comes in, followed by Delenn, through the opening (the empty spot) and then another Minbari comes in to fill that spot.

(Sudden thought...I have to check to see if we *used* that shot or if it was just in dailies...but if you count the Minbari there at the end of the scene, you'll find the count is correct.)

jms