Where is everyone getting this?

joev5638 · Jan 31, 2002

Folks,

This is driving me crazy, but I've seen messages about various episodes that were meant to be filmed of Crusade, but because of the show's cancellation (or hopefully, postponement), these were never filmed. But apparently, some people have read these and posted various details about them here.

I'm very much into the entire B5 story, and even though I didn't care for Crusade the way I dearly loved B5, I don't want to miss these stories! Are these published somewhere, and if so, how do I go about purchasing, downloading, borrowing, etc. them?

Call this the ranting of a lunatic if you want, but my recent acquisition of the nine Dell books (are there more?), the airing of Legend of The Rangers and the possibility of a series, the release of "The Gathering/In The Beginning" on DVD, and talk of the B5 series being put to DVD has got me into a B5 frenzy!

Must read missing stories...must read missing stories!

Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

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KoshN · Jan 31, 2002

As far as I know, there were three unfilmed scripts that were written:

1. Value Judgements
2. To the Ends of the Earth
3. End of the Line

The first was written by, and available from Fiona Avery. I got my authentic, autographed version from
Scripts from the Lot
but I think that site's no longer up. It still might be available directly from Fiona.

The last two (from the list above) were written by JMS, and were available FOR VIEWING ONLY on Bookface.com (~June 2000, IIRC).

Although measures were taken on Bookface.com to prevent printing or copying, some fans went to extraordinary means to get them. These two scripts were NEVER offered for sale, and if you see any copies offered for sale, or in hardcopy, they are ILLEGAL. Do not pay anybody for them, or accept them for free. Our only LEGAL hope is that JMS decides to make them available for sale, or that they get filmed.

I wish I could help you, but my hands are tied. Sorry.

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KoshN
-------------
Vorlon Empire
http://www.scifi.com/b5rangers/

[This message has been edited by KoshN (edited January 31, 2002).]

joev5638 · Jan 31, 2002

KoshN,
Thank you for the information. I'm not sure how to contact Fiona Avery, but I will endeavor to do so.

I tried to go to the site you listed for the last two episodes, but I was unable to find that site.

I truly do hope that JMS will release copies of the scripts, or continue on with the series. To be honest, I didn't like Crusade all that much, but it was mostly because the only characters I really enjoyed were Max and Dureena (sp?). I might like Galen more now, after reading the TechnoMage trilogy. But the characters didn't just jump out at me, the way Garibaldi, Sinclair, Kosh, Ivanova, Londo, and Delenn did.

That said, I think a LOTR series will be great, since Dulann, Sarah Cantrell, Tirk, Na'Feel, Firell, and David Martel all jumped out at me, and I see the possibility of Tafeek being a good character as well. I think the possibilities of LOTR are much better than those of Crusade, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to miss any of the Crusade story.

Thanks again for the information.

If anyone else has current LEGAL sources for these, or contact information which could lead me to legal sources for these, I'd still appreciate hearing.

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Kribu · Jan 31, 2002

Unfortunately I don't think there is, at the moment, any legal way of obtaining the scripts.

If you're interested, there are reviews of all the three scripts up at Mike Helba's Worlds of JMS site. Of course it's not nearly as good as actually reading the scripts, but it's better than nothing.

Oh, and welcome to the board!

------------------
"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com | Kribu.net

KoshN · Jan 31, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
KoshN,
Thank you for the information. I'm not sure how to contact Fiona Avery, but I will endeavor to do so.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You might try emailing Fiona at fionaverse-owner@yahoogroups.com to see if she still has any of Value Judgements for sale. With luck, you might get a response.

She also had The Well of Forever and Patterns of the Soul scripts for sale.
http://www.fionaavery.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fionaverse/

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
I tried to go to the site you listed for the last two episodes, but I was unable to find that site.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bookface went under (rather quickly).

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:

I truly do hope that JMS will release copies of the scripts, or continue on with the series.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You aren't the only one!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:

To be honest, I didn't like Crusade all that much, but it was mostly because the only characters I really enjoyed were Max and Dureena (sp?). I might like Galen more now, after reading the TechnoMage trilogy. But the characters didn't just jump out at me, the way Garibaldi, Sinclair, Kosh, Ivanova, Londo, and Delenn did.

That said, I think a LOTR series will be great, since Dulann, Sarah Cantrell, Tirk, Na'Feel, Firell, and David Martel all jumped out at me, and I see the possibility of Tafeek being a good character as well. I think the possibilities of LOTR are much better than those of Crusade, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to miss any of the Crusade story.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I actually am more interested in seeing Crusade than B5:LotR, at the moment. I liked all the Crusade characters except Dr. Chambers (the only one who didn't jump out at me).

------------------
KoshN
-------------
Vorlon Empire

http://www.scifi.com/b5rangers/

bakana · Feb 1, 2002

You posted that you have the "9 Dell books".

Yes, there are more.

I believe Dell published 10.
Look for "To Dream in the City of Sorrows"
Written by Kathryn Drennan
Release date: June 1997
ISBN: 0-440-22354-7 (US)
ISBN: 0-7522-2354-2 (UK)
I think that was the last (and Best) of the Dell books.
In fact, many rate it as The Best. Period.

After Dell, publishing B5 books was taken over by Dell Rey/Ballentine.
They printed 4 different Trilogies, 5 episode guides (seasonal) and the Tech manual.

There were also three Comic series published by DC.

Good reading.

------------------
Do not ascribe your own motivations to others:
At best, it will break your heart.
At worst, it will get you dead."

Kribu · Feb 1, 2002

To Dream in the City of Sorrows is Book no. 9. It even has the number on the back.

And I have never seen any references to ten Dell books, it's always been just the nine novels.

------------------
"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com | Kribu.net

bakana · Feb 1, 2002

Ok, thanks.

I couldn't find my copy right away, so I couldn't check the number.
So, joev5638 has all the Dell books.

But still has the Dell Rey trilogies to look forward to.

Oh, I also forgot to mention the Babylon 5 Cook Book.
It was published in England and is Very Difficult to find, last I heard.
But, it's a Good cookbook.
All the recipies are for real dishes and they are very nicely photographed on the facing pages.
Along with an explanation of the alien ingredients and acceptable Earth Substitutes.

Of course, since it was compiled with the cooperation of the Chef at Fresh Air, Babylon 5's Best (and most expensive) restaurant, you expect quality.

G'Kar, Londo, Delenn, Garibaldi & Ivanova selected their favorite dishes for inclusion in the cookbook.

------------------
Do not ascribe your own motivations to others:
At best, it will break your heart.
At worst, it will get you dead."

Kribu · Feb 1, 2002

Oh, indeed, the Del Rey trilogies are a must. Well, at least the Centauri and Technomage trilogies - I haven't read the Psi Corps one myself and for some reason I'm not really interested in it.

Funny how those books have come out though... the Dell books were nine, so far there are three trilogies (of, naturally, three books each)...

------------------
"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com | Kribu.net

channe · Feb 1, 2002

They're right -

Right now there is no legal way, at all, whatsoever, to read those scripts unless you're a close personal friend of JMS and he lets you.

If you get your hands on a copy, it's illegal.

It's sort of like rifling through the dumpster in the back of the bookstore for paperbacks whose covers have been stripped. When you read those books, the authors don't get paid.

JMS ain't getting his due.

Now, I don't know what the deal is with Fiona, but I think that's ok.

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channe@[url="http://cryoterrace.tripod.com"]cryoterrace[/url] | "I wonder," said Frodo, "but I don't know. And that's the way of a real tale."

joev5638 · Feb 1, 2002

Bakana,
I actually purchased the three trilogies (Bester, Centauri, Technomage) before purchasing the Dell books. Heck, I was waiting in line to get my copy of "Invoking Darkness" when it came out. I have three of the five episode guides, and am currently looking for the other two.

I agree that "To Dream In The City Of Sorrows" is far and away the best of the Dell books. It's the only book that's in the same realm as the three trilogies in terms of how well it preserves the feel of the characters from B5.

The comics will be a bit tougher, probably.

I believe you mentioned a fourth trilogy. Which is that?

Joe

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joev5638 · Feb 1, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kribu:
Oh, indeed, the Del Rey trilogies are a must. Well, at least the Centauri and Technomage trilogies - I haven't read the Psi Corps one myself and for some reason I'm not really interested in it.

Funny how those books have come out though... the Dell books were nine, so far there are three trilogies (of, naturally, three books each)...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kribu,
If you haven't read the Psi Corps trilogy, go out right now and purchase it. DO NOT WAIT! When I first found out about these books, the whole trilogy had been released. I purchased a copy for me and a copy for my best friend that day, and was stuck reading for the next few days.

My best friend is still stuck on the first book (although he's completed the Centauri trilogy). He felt the book jumped around too much with the news articles placed in the story, and he never really related to the character of "Senator Lee Crawford," which was a huge draw for me. I didn't enjoy the second book as much as the first, but the third book made up for it all. Then again, Garibaldi is my favorite B5 character.

If nothing else, read the third book of the Bester trilogy. It happens after the Telepath War, which is not covered in ANY of the books. The third book can stand alone, and you'll miss very little other than historical perspective from not having read the first two, although there will be a few spoilers for the first two books in the third.

Joe

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Kribu · Feb 1, 2002

Thanks. I may do it eventually. I'm just so not interested in Psi Corps or Bester that I feel fatigued just thinking about those books.

Besides, I can't just go out and buy them... I'd have to order them, wait for them, go to the post-office to collect them...

To Dream in the City of Sorrows was a good book indeed, although I have to say I kind of enjoyed Blood Oath as well.

I haven't read all the Dell books and I don't really plan to, either - there's so much else to read and so little time. *sigh*

------------------
"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com | Kribu.net

[This message has been edited by Kribu (edited February 01, 2002).]

joev5638 · Feb 1, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kribu:
Thanks. I may do it eventually. I'm just so not interested in Psi Corps or Bester that I feel fatigued just thinking about those books.

Besides, I can't just go out and buy them... I'd have to order them, wait for them, go to the post-office to collect them...

To Dream in the City of Sorrows was a good book indeed, although I have to say I kind of enjoyed Blood Oath as well.

I haven't read all the Dell books and I don't really plan to, either - there's so much else to read and so little time. *sigh*

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kribu,
I just finished going through "Blood Oath" for the third time earlier this week, and it's quite good. I'd also suggest reading "The Shadow Within," "Betrayals," and "Voices," in that order, as time permits. These three, along with the two you mentioned, are a cut above the rest. However, in my estimation, the first and third book of the Bester trilogy are better than all but "To Live And Dream In The City Of Sorrows."

There's also a gentle tie-in between "The Shadow Within" and the second of the Bester trilogy.

And for anyone who liked the B5 episode "The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father," the Bester Trilogy is a *MUST*.

Joe

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Kribu · Feb 1, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
I'd also suggest reading "The Shadow Within," "Betrayals," and "Voices," in that order, as time permits. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I haven't been able to find The Shadow Within anywhere - well, I've looked for it a bit, but to no avail. I can well wait until it's reprinted though (later this year?).

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>And for anyone who liked the B5 episode "The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father," the Bester Trilogy is a *MUST*.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL... It was OK, not one of my favourite eps of S5. I guess that Lyta was the only telepath I actually liked enough to take an interest in. (Well, Matheson was great as well, to make this thread more Crusade-related!

)

Thanks for the suggestions, anyway. I'll keep them in mind for the time when I *really* need a B5 fix... right now I'm just happy that another two tapes of Crusade that I ordered a while ago arrived in the mail today!

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"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com | Kribu.net

Mondo Londo · Feb 1, 2002

It's also worth mentioning that several B5 short stories have also been published. It has been reported on this site, in different threads, that DelRay is considering releasing these short stories in one paperback. That would be nice.

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"What's up, Drakh?"

Michael Garibaldi

KoshN · Feb 1, 2002

To: bakana

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by bakana:
Ok, thanks.

Oh, I also forgot to mention the Babylon 5 Cook Book.
It was published in England and is Very Difficult to find, last I heard.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I found one on eBay and worked a deal with a guy in England to get it (for my extra copy of "The Shadow Within" in trade + cash).

To: joev5638

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
I actually purchased the three trilogies (Bester, Centauri, Technomage) before purchasing the Dell books. Heck, I was waiting in line to get my copy of "Invoking Darkness" when it came out. I have three of the five episode guides, and am currently looking for the other two.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Get the other two episode guides from Amazon, or Waldenbooks. If you're a Preferred Reader Member at Waldenbooks, you'll get 10% off, and they don't charge shipping for special orders. I get almost all my B5 books at Waldenbooks, mostly via special order, since rarely is anything in stock. Right now they only have one copy of Centauri Prime Book #2 (which they ordered by mistake for me, instead of getting me Book #3), and a few of "Summoning Light" and "Invoking Darkness." It's best to give Waldenbooks a printout with the Titles and ISBNs on it.

B5 Book and Short Story Info. (ISBNs, etc)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
I agree that "To Dream In The City Of Sorrows" is far and away the best of the Dell books. It's the only book that's in the same realm as the three trilogies in terms of how well it preserves the feel of the characters from B5.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, The Shadow Within was also very good.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
The comics will be a bit tougher, probably.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

eBay

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by joev5638:
I believe you mentioned a fourth trilogy. Which is that?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

There are only three Del Rey Babylon 5 trilogies.

------------------
KoshN
-------------
Vorlon Empire
http://www.scifi.com/b5rangers/

[This message has been edited by KoshN (edited February 01, 2002).]

KoshN · Feb 1, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kribu:
Oh, indeed, the Del Rey trilogies are a must. Well, at least the Centauri and Technomage trilogies - I haven't read the Psi Corps one myself and for some reason I'm not really interested in it.

Funny how those books have come out though... the Dell books were nine, so far there are three trilogies (of, naturally, three books each)...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very Minbari-like, eh?

You really should get the Psi Corps Trilogy. Just be prepared to take notes, because it helps you keep the characters and their aliases straight, and the bloodlines/family trees.

Trust me. They're worth reading, especially for the Vorlon connections (and that's all I'm saying).

------------------
KoshN
-------------
Vorlon Empire

http://www.scifi.com/b5rangers/

bakana · Feb 1, 2002

Fourth Trilogy:

Sorry, I misspoke. I meantto say the 3 Movie Novelizations.
If you like those sort of books.
There are things in the novelizations that didn't Fit on the screen.

------------------
Do not ascribe your own motivations to others:
At best, it will break your heart.
At worst, it will get you dead."

Lyta · Feb 1, 2002

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Lyta:
The only thing I don't have on the site is information about the cookbook (since it is hard to find <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, I just want to correct that and say that I do now have an entry for it on
this page of my site. I happened to find some information about it and pictures of the cover as well.

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Pouch-sucking spawn of a bladder fish! Son of a fitch piece of smelt! Tok-swallowing fenbarger! Thrak it! --Na'Feel swearing in B5LR

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