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Why so much B5 hostility?
- Thread starter Dekion
- Start date
warning to GideonsMine, I will explode on you for that statement about your IQ, so I'd like to apologize beforehand, but I'm telling you, don't ever post anything unfounded, or even worse, something scientifically impossible(like what you did)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GideonsMine:
I have a 240 IQ, had numerous science awards when I was in school, spelling bee champion six years in a row in my state, am an executive patent law secretary now and I can type 140 words per minute.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think someone was beaten with the "arrogant" stick
The average human IQ is 100, I beleive that even the person that is in the guinness book of world records has less than that, I may be wrong though. If I am not wrong, you gotta take off atleast 200 points off of that because you gotta be pretty stupid not to even know how IQ levels work.
I located information that has been proven by countless scientist and is accepted by the intelligent world (not some guy that hangs out at a messageboard and claim to have an over 200 IQ)
- A normal intelligence quotient (IQ) ranges from 85 to 115 (According to the Stanford-Binet scale). Only approximately 1% of the people in the world have an IQ of 135 or over.
- Cox also found that different fields have quite widely varying average IQs for their acknowledged leading geniuses. She gives the following figures (the number in brackets is the number in the sample considered):
Philosophers (22) average IQ 173; Scientists (39) 164; Fiction writers (53) 163; Statesmen (43) 159; Musicians (11) 153; Artists (13) 150; Soldiers (27) 133.
*these aren't your average people, these are the greatest geniuses in history and their averaged IQs*
- While the intelligence quotient in theory has no upper limit for children, it is often considered as unmeasurable for adults if it exceeds 200 (Normally, it is never set above 210. However, highest possible scores to date should lie in the interval 210-220 with decreasing probability).
Ok these are my arguments, just cuz you think you are a smartass, I don't agree, and I got facts to back it up, so there!
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If you go to New Jersey, you will die!
[This message has been edited by solaris5 (edited May 16, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by solaris5 (edited May 16, 2001).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GideonsMine:
I have a 240 IQ, had numerous science awards when I was in school, spelling bee champion six years in a row in my state, am an executive patent law secretary now and I can type 140 words per minute.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think someone was beaten with the "arrogant" stick
The average human IQ is 100, I beleive that even the person that is in the guinness book of world records has less than that, I may be wrong though. If I am not wrong, you gotta take off atleast 200 points off of that because you gotta be pretty stupid not to even know how IQ levels work.
I located information that has been proven by countless scientist and is accepted by the intelligent world (not some guy that hangs out at a messageboard and claim to have an over 200 IQ)
- A normal intelligence quotient (IQ) ranges from 85 to 115 (According to the Stanford-Binet scale). Only approximately 1% of the people in the world have an IQ of 135 or over.
- Cox also found that different fields have quite widely varying average IQs for their acknowledged leading geniuses. She gives the following figures (the number in brackets is the number in the sample considered):
Philosophers (22) average IQ 173; Scientists (39) 164; Fiction writers (53) 163; Statesmen (43) 159; Musicians (11) 153; Artists (13) 150; Soldiers (27) 133.
*these aren't your average people, these are the greatest geniuses in history and their averaged IQs*
- While the intelligence quotient in theory has no upper limit for children, it is often considered as unmeasurable for adults if it exceeds 200 (Normally, it is never set above 210. However, highest possible scores to date should lie in the interval 210-220 with decreasing probability).
Ok these are my arguments, just cuz you think you are a smartass, I don't agree, and I got facts to back it up, so there!
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If you go to New Jersey, you will die!
[This message has been edited by solaris5 (edited May 16, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by solaris5 (edited May 16, 2001).]
Kribu
Administrator
First off, I must admit I don't know much about ST. I remember vaguely having watched something - I think it was TNG as I seem to recall it had Patrick Stewart in it - a long time ago as a kid.
I remember I liked it but then it sort of disappeared and I haven't watched any Trek for... at least ten years.
Therefore I'm not even trying to compare - but I don't go 'round bashing ST or any other scifi shows I haven't seen or liked. I like B5. I could almost say I love B5.
It's not perfect by any means (don't get me wrong here! but there are lots of little things, logical errors etc that you start noticing when you watch the series for the 2nd time) but what is? It's an imperfect world, after all.
What I do think is that while ST may well have been the series that made other scifi shows, including eventually B5, possible, this does not necessarily mean that it's better. (Maybe it is better, as I said, I don't want to get into an argument here!).
It certainly doesn't mean that everything that's come after ST is by default worse. Or that you have to wait 30 years before you can say which one is better. It's just a matter of personal opinion, I doubt either could ever be objectively declared "better".
I do think it's kind of silly to venomously attack something that (a) is different, (b) you haven't watched and aren't planning to watch, (c) you just don't like for some reason or other (hey, if everyone had the same taste, the world would be a very boring place).
There are lots of things I don't like but I see no reason to post a message such as "*** SUX" anywhere. I don't see a reason to hurt or insult the people who do like these things.
Of course, if someone feels that they need to just plain insult others with a different taste, that's their right. I just happen to think that unprovoked insults... well... suck.
(A disclaimer: if there are any spelling and grammar errors in this terribly long post, it's because English is not my native language and I'm also rather sleepy.)
(Side note to anyone interested, although I don't think it has much to do with this topic or any others, for that matter: my IQ is 145. Not quite the "highest genius" level, I'm afraid, but it will have to do. I've never considered myself a particularily smart person... occasionally, of course, we all have delusions of grandeur but then I've usually looked around and realised that most people I know surpass me in so many things...
)
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"You've misspelled this. There's no 'Y' in liberties."
"Oh, go away. Repress someone else."
[This message has been edited by Kribu (edited May 16, 2001).]
I remember I liked it but then it sort of disappeared and I haven't watched any Trek for... at least ten years.
Therefore I'm not even trying to compare - but I don't go 'round bashing ST or any other scifi shows I haven't seen or liked. I like B5. I could almost say I love B5.
What I do think is that while ST may well have been the series that made other scifi shows, including eventually B5, possible, this does not necessarily mean that it's better. (Maybe it is better, as I said, I don't want to get into an argument here!).
It certainly doesn't mean that everything that's come after ST is by default worse. Or that you have to wait 30 years before you can say which one is better. It's just a matter of personal opinion, I doubt either could ever be objectively declared "better".
I do think it's kind of silly to venomously attack something that (a) is different, (b) you haven't watched and aren't planning to watch, (c) you just don't like for some reason or other (hey, if everyone had the same taste, the world would be a very boring place).
There are lots of things I don't like but I see no reason to post a message such as "*** SUX" anywhere. I don't see a reason to hurt or insult the people who do like these things.
Of course, if someone feels that they need to just plain insult others with a different taste, that's their right. I just happen to think that unprovoked insults... well... suck.
(A disclaimer: if there are any spelling and grammar errors in this terribly long post, it's because English is not my native language and I'm also rather sleepy.)
(Side note to anyone interested, although I don't think it has much to do with this topic or any others, for that matter: my IQ is 145. Not quite the "highest genius" level, I'm afraid, but it will have to do. I've never considered myself a particularily smart person... occasionally, of course, we all have delusions of grandeur but then I've usually looked around and realised that most people I know surpass me in so many things...
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"You've misspelled this. There's no 'Y' in liberties."
"Oh, go away. Repress someone else."
[This message has been edited by Kribu (edited May 16, 2001).]
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
To fellow posters - take your time, maybe a sip of some relaxing Minbari tea, avoid sparks in flammable discussions. We are all one.
Even though I've lurked on some SF boards for a while now, I've actually never seen all-out hostility towards Babylon 5. The "worst" comment might well have been: "the writers at B5 must have a wicked sense of humour".
...which is a most friendly statement - after I quoted Londo's famous words about cats.
Oh, certainly... we can't expect everybody to like something. There will always be people with other tastes, those in a bad mood and those who don't master the arts of diplomacy/arguing. People have a tendency to form prejudices. It is inevitable. Kosh would say it is irrelevant. Delenn would say we must not let the prejudices disturb us.
The probability of encountering pre-formed opinions is higher in some contexts... but we should not form our opinions about these contexts basing on someone's opinion on Babylon 5.
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Canned flarn is a sacrilege.
Even though I've lurked on some SF boards for a while now, I've actually never seen all-out hostility towards Babylon 5. The "worst" comment might well have been: "the writers at B5 must have a wicked sense of humour".
Oh, certainly... we can't expect everybody to like something. There will always be people with other tastes, those in a bad mood and those who don't master the arts of diplomacy/arguing. People have a tendency to form prejudices. It is inevitable. Kosh would say it is irrelevant. Delenn would say we must not let the prejudices disturb us.
The probability of encountering pre-formed opinions is higher in some contexts... but we should not form our opinions about these contexts basing on someone's opinion on Babylon 5.
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Canned flarn is a sacrilege.
Sinclair
Moderator
I think that part of the problem stems from the fact that Star Trek is more widely known. Just ask anyone and they'll probably have no problem telling you who Kirk or Spock is, but ask them about who Kosh or Garibaldi is and they probably won't have a clue. People that don't watch B5 probably have misconceptions about what it is about. Some may think that it's just another version of Trek, or others may not like it simply because it is not Trek. There are undoubtedly a wide variety of reasons why there is a certain amount of hostility towards B5, although I have never personally seen any.
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You name it, sooner or later, everyone comes to Babylon 5.
-Commander Jeffrey David Sinclair, The Gathering
[This message has been edited by Sinclair (edited May 16, 2001).]
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You name it, sooner or later, everyone comes to Babylon 5.
-Commander Jeffrey David Sinclair, The Gathering
[This message has been edited by Sinclair (edited May 16, 2001).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Hisssssssssssssssssssss, Babylon Intelligence the poison person from California, I will match my intelligence against yours any time, any day. I am 42, born in Hawaii...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
and you act like you're about 12....
No one was saying that ST fans aren't intelligent. It was simply pointed out that a lot (go back and re-read that, it says a lot, not all) of them are not necessarily hard-core sci-fi fans and watch ST for other reasons (the characters, the story, gene's vision, what have you) aside from the sci-fi element, and that B5 simply appeals more to the true sci-fi addicts.
As for intelligence, you may in fact be an incredibly smart person. From what you've written, it sounds like you are, but you might want to work a little on the litarary comprehension.... or at least stop taking generalizations made about a large number of people as a personal attack. It's not yoru statements that bother me. You have every right to make them. It's the hostility behind them.
No one here was trying to offend anyone.
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"Expect me, when you see me."
and you act like you're about 12....
No one was saying that ST fans aren't intelligent. It was simply pointed out that a lot (go back and re-read that, it says a lot, not all) of them are not necessarily hard-core sci-fi fans and watch ST for other reasons (the characters, the story, gene's vision, what have you) aside from the sci-fi element, and that B5 simply appeals more to the true sci-fi addicts.
As for intelligence, you may in fact be an incredibly smart person. From what you've written, it sounds like you are, but you might want to work a little on the litarary comprehension.... or at least stop taking generalizations made about a large number of people as a personal attack. It's not yoru statements that bother me. You have every right to make them. It's the hostility behind them.
No one here was trying to offend anyone.
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"Expect me, when you see me."
G Kar of the Kha Ri
Regular
I've experienced some hostility at GameShark.com. A few people have been there to support B5, but many merely ask, "What's a Babylon?", or something equally odd. Many show more interest in ST, and the more well known rep of ST probably is the reason. Like others here have said, B5 isn't as mainstream as ST is. But it pains me to see people writing that the writing in B5 sucks, or the actors suck. We here all know that JMS can write some good stuff, and I can never really pick a fav character because I have always thought that the actors are all very good (though the relationship between G'Kar and Londo has generally made them two of the cooler members of the cast).
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--Garibaldi-- "Maybe they should've labeled the future 'Some Assembly Required'."
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--Garibaldi-- "Maybe they should've labeled the future 'Some Assembly Required'."
GideonsMine
Beyond the rim
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Derian:
and you act like you're about 12....
No one was saying that ST fans aren't intelligent. It was simply pointed out that a lot (go back and re-read that, it says a lot, not all) of them are not necessarily hard-core sci-fi fans and watch ST for other reasons (the characters, the story, gene's vision, what have you) aside from the sci-fi element, and that B5 simply appeals more to the true sci-fi addicts.
As for intelligence, you may in fact be an incredibly smart person. From what you've written, it sounds like you are, but you might want to work a little on the litarary comprehension.... or at least stop taking generalizations made about a large number of people as a personal attack. It's not yoru statements that bother me. You have every right to make them. It's the hostility behind them.
No one here was trying to offend anyone.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Reread his or her post. If you take the words literally, Star Trek fans are "simple minded" and cannot understand an intelligent show. That's not insulting to you?
I was not acting 12. I don't understand the war at all.
B5 is not better than Trek, it is just different. It stands on its own, and that's wonderful. You compare apples and oranges when you try to eradicate thirty years of life by comparing a much different day and age. I doubt B5 would have made it if it aired 30 years ago. We couldn't even comprehend Spock ears back then let alone the looks of Lennier and others. I still don't think we do as what starts out definitely different, gradually softens to a more "human" difference within a season or two.
The thing is, whether Trek fans want to admit it or not, or B5 fans want to admit it or not, both shows will live on in infamy in the sci fi world. And I know there is more to come, not only from JMS but from groupages of authors that are expanding even further. I for one can't wait to see what the future brings in this medium.
If you think on it, there are things on sci fi that are no more than laugh bait. Killer Klowns from Outer Space, First Wave, etc. I mean really.
Long live JMS
and whoever else comes along, they are always welcome.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
and you act like you're about 12....
No one was saying that ST fans aren't intelligent. It was simply pointed out that a lot (go back and re-read that, it says a lot, not all) of them are not necessarily hard-core sci-fi fans and watch ST for other reasons (the characters, the story, gene's vision, what have you) aside from the sci-fi element, and that B5 simply appeals more to the true sci-fi addicts.
As for intelligence, you may in fact be an incredibly smart person. From what you've written, it sounds like you are, but you might want to work a little on the litarary comprehension.... or at least stop taking generalizations made about a large number of people as a personal attack. It's not yoru statements that bother me. You have every right to make them. It's the hostility behind them.
No one here was trying to offend anyone.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Reread his or her post. If you take the words literally, Star Trek fans are "simple minded" and cannot understand an intelligent show. That's not insulting to you?
I was not acting 12. I don't understand the war at all.
B5 is not better than Trek, it is just different. It stands on its own, and that's wonderful. You compare apples and oranges when you try to eradicate thirty years of life by comparing a much different day and age. I doubt B5 would have made it if it aired 30 years ago. We couldn't even comprehend Spock ears back then let alone the looks of Lennier and others. I still don't think we do as what starts out definitely different, gradually softens to a more "human" difference within a season or two.
The thing is, whether Trek fans want to admit it or not, or B5 fans want to admit it or not, both shows will live on in infamy in the sci fi world. And I know there is more to come, not only from JMS but from groupages of authors that are expanding even further. I for one can't wait to see what the future brings in this medium.
If you think on it, there are things on sci fi that are no more than laugh bait. Killer Klowns from Outer Space, First Wave, etc. I mean really.
Long live JMS
and whoever else comes along, they are always welcome.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
GideonsMine
Beyond the rim
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dekion:
Thank you for the honest response. I have nothing but respect for Classic Trek, which is a great show. I think B5 is better, but Classic Trek is a close second. I have not bashed Trek, unless it was to complain about Voyager, which is just plain bad IMHO. It is true that without Trek there would be no B5, no argument there. But saying that B5 does not belong in the same league as Trek is presumptous. The day B5 won its first HUGO that changed. The oldest is not always the best. Monarchy is not "better" than democracy, yet monarchy is a far older system of government. You are right about the apples and oranges thing. I too am a Trek fan, and Classic Trek (and to a lesser degree TNG and DS9) have made an indellible mark on me. That is not to say anything bad on either show. I have yet to see a B5 post bash Trek. Have you? Where? Is it as frequent as on the Trek boards?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Dekion, I am going out on a limb here.
One, I never said that B5 doesn't belong in the same whatever as Trek. Technically, B5 is a better show in the aspect that the writing is more upgraded than the original Trek (and please notice, I only mention the original Trek as everything was an offspring from that as is the case with B5 and its offspring), the display of graphics is certainly beyond compare, ship designs have gotten more complicated and with the advent of the designs we can produce now (which could not be produced thiry some years ago), no, if anything, Trek only holds its original statute that it was the first. It holds a soft spot in my heart because it was the first show where I truly identified with the characters. Now that is second nature to me.
this is why I do not compare the two. Too many years have gone in between the two shows, and one will always pale by nature because we are now an age of internet, computers, and many other things that were not more than a sparkle in someones thoughts when Trek was created.
I love both shows, for different reasons. Nothing will ever change that.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
Thank you for the honest response. I have nothing but respect for Classic Trek, which is a great show. I think B5 is better, but Classic Trek is a close second. I have not bashed Trek, unless it was to complain about Voyager, which is just plain bad IMHO. It is true that without Trek there would be no B5, no argument there. But saying that B5 does not belong in the same league as Trek is presumptous. The day B5 won its first HUGO that changed. The oldest is not always the best. Monarchy is not "better" than democracy, yet monarchy is a far older system of government. You are right about the apples and oranges thing. I too am a Trek fan, and Classic Trek (and to a lesser degree TNG and DS9) have made an indellible mark on me. That is not to say anything bad on either show. I have yet to see a B5 post bash Trek. Have you? Where? Is it as frequent as on the Trek boards?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Dekion, I am going out on a limb here.
One, I never said that B5 doesn't belong in the same whatever as Trek. Technically, B5 is a better show in the aspect that the writing is more upgraded than the original Trek (and please notice, I only mention the original Trek as everything was an offspring from that as is the case with B5 and its offspring), the display of graphics is certainly beyond compare, ship designs have gotten more complicated and with the advent of the designs we can produce now (which could not be produced thiry some years ago), no, if anything, Trek only holds its original statute that it was the first. It holds a soft spot in my heart because it was the first show where I truly identified with the characters. Now that is second nature to me.
this is why I do not compare the two. Too many years have gone in between the two shows, and one will always pale by nature because we are now an age of internet, computers, and many other things that were not more than a sparkle in someones thoughts when Trek was created.
I love both shows, for different reasons. Nothing will ever change that.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
GideonsMine
Beyond the rim
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by solaris5:
warning to GideonsMine, I will explode on you for that statement about your IQ, so I'd like to apologize beforehand, but I'm telling you, don't ever post anything unfounded, or even worse, something scientifically impossible(like what you did)
By New Jersey standards (I am from New Jersey by the way and no, you will not die if you go there), back prior to the end of my first year in Monmouth Regional HS, I was tested. By New Jersey standards, I was tested at 240 (like it or not) and spent the next four years not in HS but in Rutgers University. I have six college degrees that were obtained by the time I was 19. Again, I reiterate, I am as intelligent as the next person, maybe more, I like both Star Trek and B5, I see no reason to constantly compare what cannot be compared.
Oh well, people see things as they want to and they sell so much short by being sticklers to their idea alone.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
warning to GideonsMine, I will explode on you for that statement about your IQ, so I'd like to apologize beforehand, but I'm telling you, don't ever post anything unfounded, or even worse, something scientifically impossible(like what you did)
Originally posted by GideonsMine:
I have a 240 IQ, had numerous science awards when I was in school, spelling bee champion six years in a row in my state, am an executive patent law secretary now and I can type 140 words per minute.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think someone was beaten with the "arrogant" stick
The average human IQ is 100, I beleive that even the person that is in the guinness book of world records has less than that, I may be wrong though. If I am not wrong, you gotta take off atleast 200 points off of that because you gotta be pretty stupid not to even know how IQ levels work.
I located information that has been proven by countless scientist and is accepted by the intelligent world (not some guy that hangs out at a messageboard and claim to have an over 200 IQ)
- A normal intelligence quotient (IQ) ranges from 85 to 115 (According to the Stanford-Binet scale). Only approximately 1% of the people in the world have an IQ of 135 or over.
- Cox also found that different fields have quite widely varying average IQs for their acknowledged leading geniuses. She gives the following figures (the number in brackets is the number in the sample considered):
Philosophers (22) average IQ 173; Scientists (39) 164; Fiction writers (53) 163; Statesmen (43) 159; Musicians (11) 153; Artists (13) 150; Soldiers (27) 133.
*these aren't your average people, these are the greatest geniuses in history and their averaged IQs*
- While the intelligence quotient in theory has no upper limit for children, it is often considered as unmeasurable for adults if it exceeds 200 (Normally, it is never set above 210. However, highest possible scores to date should lie in the interval 210-220 with decreasing probability).
Ok these are my arguments, just cuz you think you are a smartass, I don't agree, and I got facts to back it up, so there!
By New Jersey standards (I am from New Jersey by the way and no, you will not die if you go there), back prior to the end of my first year in Monmouth Regional HS, I was tested. By New Jersey standards, I was tested at 240 (like it or not) and spent the next four years not in HS but in Rutgers University. I have six college degrees that were obtained by the time I was 19. Again, I reiterate, I am as intelligent as the next person, maybe more, I like both Star Trek and B5, I see no reason to constantly compare what cannot be compared.
Oh well, people see things as they want to and they sell so much short by being sticklers to their idea alone.
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Colleen L. Stanford
Gideon's Mine, all Mine
(he just doesn't know it yet, LOL)
I appreciate Gideons Mine's comments, and I thank you for them. I agree with you in much of what you have said, and the reason I started this thread was to get some answers as to why some people are so hostile. If all of them thought the way you do, there would be no problem. Once again, thank you for the posts, they were a great counterpoint.
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There's a real hard core minority of trek fans out there who don't want ANY competition to trek. They've gotten it into their heads that the future WILL be the one portrayed by trek, and get very uncomfortable with the idea that it might not. A show like B5, with a much grittier, realistic future is just intolerable to them.
Please understand I don't mean to say all trek fans, or even a majority of them are like this, but there is a small group of zealots out there who think the universe is only big enough for one "deep space franchise".
When you get right down to it, it's pretty funny that a group who preaches "infinite diversity in infinite combinations" practices something entirely different.
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You cant kill a man born to hang
Please understand I don't mean to say all trek fans, or even a majority of them are like this, but there is a small group of zealots out there who think the universe is only big enough for one "deep space franchise".
When you get right down to it, it's pretty funny that a group who preaches "infinite diversity in infinite combinations" practices something entirely different.
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You cant kill a man born to hang
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
Maybe dude is a genius... even Wyle E. Coyote "Super Genius" couldn't catch that damn road runner.
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hypatia
Regular
Whenever someone claims a high IQ to prove a point, you can bet that they failed to prove it. I saw many many students fail out of college who probably were far more intelligent than I. As I earned my B.S. and M.S. in math I found that the people who bragged the most, usually accomplished the least. Whenever someone thinks they are proving a point by saying "and I have an IQ of..." you can bet that they didn't actually prove anything.
And isn't it interesting that this part of the thread came out of a question about why people are so hostile? I go back to what I posted earlier: if you hate a show don't watch it. I'd add now: and shut up about it. I hated Baywatch, but never bothered to tell anyone about it. I just didn't watch it. End of story.
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And isn't it interesting that this part of the thread came out of a question about why people are so hostile? I go back to what I posted earlier: if you hate a show don't watch it. I'd add now: and shut up about it. I hated Baywatch, but never bothered to tell anyone about it. I just didn't watch it. End of story.
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D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
Hey, I got out of law school and I can't even do basic algebra. Be that as it may, I must disagree with your sentiment about watching a show that you don't like. Take Voyager and EFC, for example, I don't particularly "like" either of them, but I watch just in case they evolve into a good tv show. (which may sound funny, but it has paid off more times than I can count.... ST:TNG, ST
S9, B5, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Angel...etc.)
As far as keeping your mouth shut about something you don't like.... well, that doesn't seem like very wise advise to me. I tend to keep my mouth shut about things that I like and rant about those that I don't like... its the American Way.
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As far as keeping your mouth shut about something you don't like.... well, that doesn't seem like very wise advise to me. I tend to keep my mouth shut about things that I like and rant about those that I don't like... its the American Way.
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GideonsMine:
Without Star Trek I doubt B5 would have come about so easily.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Easily!? Jms went through 5 years of getting told that "Science Fiction doesn't sell. Trek does." His agent told him that he was damaging his career, and should be consentrating on pitching a show with some chance of getting bought. But Joe was persistant, and finally met the right individual at Warner Bros. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Why not just give credit where credit is due. We were the first, we are the original, and thanks to our existence, others sprang from the well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ever heard of this litte show called Lost in Space?
Without Star Trek I doubt B5 would have come about so easily.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Easily!? Jms went through 5 years of getting told that "Science Fiction doesn't sell. Trek does." His agent told him that he was damaging his career, and should be consentrating on pitching a show with some chance of getting bought. But Joe was persistant, and finally met the right individual at Warner Bros. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Why not just give credit where credit is due. We were the first, we are the original, and thanks to our existence, others sprang from the well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ever heard of this litte show called Lost in Space?
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
I think some meditation is required for this thread.
As for IQ's and other mental capabilities - this is, after all, the Web. One can imply and/or declare anything so I tend to ignore any challenges, assumptions, and outright declarations, especially when made in the heat of the moment. We tend to do that in real life, so why not here??
<|_|] Anyone??
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"So where does the power come from to see the race to its end? It comes from within."
As for IQ's and other mental capabilities - this is, after all, the Web. One can imply and/or declare anything so I tend to ignore any challenges, assumptions, and outright declarations, especially when made in the heat of the moment. We tend to do that in real life, so why not here??
<|_|] Anyone??
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"So where does the power come from to see the race to its end? It comes from within."
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
I agree..I've never heard of anyone with a IQ of more than say 220..so if Gideon's Mine is telling the truth she better contact Guiness.
It's silly to say the Star Trek was responsible for B5. Star Trek wasn't the first thing in Scifi. Hell when it was on it did badly in the ratings...even worse than some scifi before it.
I'd say B5 takes more from like Battlestar Galactica or even Star Wars before I'd say Star Trek.
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"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors come with too high a price. I'd look up at your lifeless eyes and wave like this. Can you and your associates arrange it for me, Mr. Morden?"
Vir - In The Shadow of Z' HA Dum
It's silly to say the Star Trek was responsible for B5. Star Trek wasn't the first thing in Scifi. Hell when it was on it did badly in the ratings...even worse than some scifi before it.
I'd say B5 takes more from like Battlestar Galactica or even Star Wars before I'd say Star Trek.
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"I'd like to live just long enough to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a pike as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors come with too high a price. I'd look up at your lifeless eyes and wave like this. Can you and your associates arrange it for me, Mr. Morden?"
Vir - In The Shadow of Z' HA Dum
UncleMikey
Member
If we're going to be strictly honest with ourselves, I think we B5 fen have to admit that we brought some amount of the Trek-side hostility down upon ourselves.
I am a proud and loud fan of Star Trek (well, except for VGR, which I could never get into) as well as B5. I spent several years writing Trek reviews, and moderating first TREK-REVIEW-L and rec.arts.startrek.reviews, and then B5-REVIEW-L as well.
And yet, the truth is, when B5 came out, I became very snobbish about Trek. Someone here has already mentioned how many of us who were fans of both series started holding Trek up to B5's standard in terms of storytelling. He's right; we did. And not just in a 'well, I guess they just tell stories differently' sort of way, either. No, we were, by and large, snotty about it.
Trek, to be honest, didn't help its case with us any when it began to...um...borrow elements from B5 for DS9. Adding insult to injury, Paramount rushed DS9 to the screen, so that the first DS9 episodes aired before the B5 pilot, let alone series, had aired, even tho' the B5 pilot had been finished nearly a year earlier! That made many of us...well, a little indignant, and perhaps a bit embarrassed about the former love of our geeky lives, and we retaliated with venom, myself not least of all.
Now, with several years remove from both series, I'm actually regretting not spending more time watching DS9 -- not instead of B5, mind you, but in addition to it -- because the flashes of DS9 I've caught I've enjoyed tremendously.
But of course, hindsight is 20-20.
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Mike "Uncle Mikey" Shappe
I am a proud and loud fan of Star Trek (well, except for VGR, which I could never get into) as well as B5. I spent several years writing Trek reviews, and moderating first TREK-REVIEW-L and rec.arts.startrek.reviews, and then B5-REVIEW-L as well.
And yet, the truth is, when B5 came out, I became very snobbish about Trek. Someone here has already mentioned how many of us who were fans of both series started holding Trek up to B5's standard in terms of storytelling. He's right; we did. And not just in a 'well, I guess they just tell stories differently' sort of way, either. No, we were, by and large, snotty about it.
Trek, to be honest, didn't help its case with us any when it began to...um...borrow elements from B5 for DS9. Adding insult to injury, Paramount rushed DS9 to the screen, so that the first DS9 episodes aired before the B5 pilot, let alone series, had aired, even tho' the B5 pilot had been finished nearly a year earlier! That made many of us...well, a little indignant, and perhaps a bit embarrassed about the former love of our geeky lives, and we retaliated with venom, myself not least of all.
Now, with several years remove from both series, I'm actually regretting not spending more time watching DS9 -- not instead of B5, mind you, but in addition to it -- because the flashes of DS9 I've caught I've enjoyed tremendously.
But of course, hindsight is 20-20.
--
Mike "Uncle Mikey" Shappe
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
UncleMikey - true - fans should try to avoid and ignore the neck-to-neck competition between companies (Paramount and Warner for example) which sometimes goes to accusing each other of "scorched earth tactics" or "borrowing".
We should concern ourselves with helping our favourite shows become better, instead of worrying if other shows "threaten" them or not. Please allow me to address the above topic with a slightly modified quotation from you-know-whom...
"Companies deal in matters of money, not conscience. If they fall behind it's up to the rest of us to make the difference. If we don't, who will?"
[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited May 17, 2001).]
We should concern ourselves with helping our favourite shows become better, instead of worrying if other shows "threaten" them or not. Please allow me to address the above topic with a slightly modified quotation from you-know-whom...
"Companies deal in matters of money, not conscience. If they fall behind it's up to the rest of us to make the difference. If we don't, who will?"
[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited May 17, 2001).]
