EpDis: Day Of The Dead

[vacantlook]

Refresher Links:
Lurker's Guide Main Page for Day Of The Dead
Lurker's Guide Extended Synopsis for Day Of The Dead

 

[MMarin]

Day of the Dead is one of the rare episodes from the fifth season that I actually love. Sure, I might have wanted to see some different people facing the ghosts from the past (like for instance Sheridan instead of Lennier) but as it is the episode is still so full of tense atmosphere that it deserves an A.

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

My biggest gripe with the episode is the absurd notion that G'Kar, at that point in his character's arc, would be reticent -- frightened, even! -- to face the spiritual unknown. Bah, humbug!

 

[Ranger1]

i can buy G'Kar's fear, but what i always wondered was why was Garibaldi visited by dodger, sure if he wasn't with lise then it could be the ghost of a missed opportunity, but i don't buy her as the ghost of missed opportunities in general. though Morden visiting Ranger Lennier was genius, because it is testament to his reasons for joining the honoured ranks of the anla'shak, he joined to try and escape his fate as an also ran in Delenn's life and as a result tried to kill Sheridan, whether or not he went back is unimportant, it gets an A all the way, the only episode in the Byron string to get one from me.

 

[KoshN]

i can buy G'Kar's fear, but what i always wondered was why was Garibaldi visited by dodger, sure if he wasn't with lise then it could be the ghost of a missed opportunity, but i don't buy her as the ghost of missed opportunities in general.

I get the feeling that Dodger wanted to see Garibaldi, i.e. that the impetus for that visit was from Dodger's end of things.

 

[GKarsEye]

i can buy G'Kar's fear, but what i always wondered was why was Garibaldi visited by dodger, sure if he wasn't with lise then it could be the ghost of a missed opportunity, but i don't buy her as the ghost of missed opportunities in general.

I get the feeling that Dodger wanted to see Garibaldi, i.e. that the impetus for that visit was from Dodger's end of things.

I can't imagine (assuming a dead spirit can even exist and want to and is able to visit a living person) that she'd so very much want to hang out with some guy she met once who just didn't want to fuck her. Besides, the theme of the episode was that the people were visited by those who they needed to see.

I guess Garibaldi needed Dodger as someone who could offer him a bit of companionship that wasn't burdened with judgement and expectations. As much as Lise and Franklin and everybody around him cares about him, it's conditional and accompanied with demands: don't drink, do your job, etc. Dodger just wants to hang out and have a little fun. That's a nice feeling.

 

[KoshN]

My biggest gripe with the episode is the absurd notion that G'Kar, at that point in his character's arc, would be reticent -- frightened, even! -- to face the spiritual unknown. Bah, humbug!

Eh, G'Kar was probably reacting based upon what he'd heard as a child, about the Brakiri Day of the Dead. Also, there are probably a few people in G'Kar's pre-enlightenment past, that he'd rather avoid. A bit of reflexive apprehension is understandable, even for 2262 G'Kar.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

My biggest gripe with the episode is the absurd notion that G'Kar, at that point in his character's arc, would be reticent -- frightened, even! -- to face the spiritual unknown. Bah, humbug!

I took G'Kar's reaction to be more like Gandalf's rejection of the Ring. The Barkiri are messing around with powerful forces that they little understand (as far as G'Kar can tell) and which have tremendous potential for evil. I think he wants to stay away from it all precisely because at this point in his spiritual journey (where his wisdom has already made him the wong kind of religious figure) he fears that he might be able to tap into that power himself and he has no idea if he would control it or it him. There's also the question of lying or false spirits. If he meets G'Quon will it be the real one, a fake or some figment of his own imagination and ego dressed up as G'Quon to tell G'Kar what he wants to hear. And how will his followers react? No one will believe him if he says he has no vistor, they'll just keep badgering him until he tells them. And how much worse will things get for him if word gets out that G'Quon personally visited G'Kar from the Great Beyond.

I think there are all sorts of reasons besides cowardice that G'Kar might fear the very notion of what is about to happen and not only avoid it himself, but counsel Lochley against allowing it and others from participating.

A lot of people I know of widely varying spiritual beliefs avoid things like Ouija boards on the purely prudential grounds that if you believe in spirits you don't want to open an unctrolled door to whoever might be wandering around out there. It isn't so much fear as humility that suggests there might be things in the universe that we can't handle and are better left un-messed-with. G'Kar's attitude towards the Dead is not unlike his attitude towards the Walkers at Sigma 927.

Regards,

Joe

 

[Shaal Mayan]

I just love this episode from season five there are very few that get an AAA .As for G'kar's reaction towards the dead was very realistic in that even G'kar is afraid or doesn't want to open a pandora's box if you will in the realm of something unknown.And maybe best left untouched.

 

[puzzle]

It was a good episode, and a definite speculation starter.

I only found it unrealistic that nobody external (a third party, a curious bystander) showed up to record, measure, watch, reverse-engineer and analyse the event.

If it's a major Brakiri festival, and produces majorly unexplainable effects, I'm sure someone curious, or just hungry for technology, would have shown up and tried, by all peaceful means, to record, bug and log everything.

You can obviously tell that if I knew the background, I would try to.

However, I recognize that from a storytelling perspective, telling of the experiences of an oveteched analyst determined to solve the puzzle, might be dry and not so interesting, compared to direct subjective experiences of our favourite characters.

 

[Chilli]

Main beef with the episode: Rebo and Zooty.

I thought it spoiled the whole concept of Rebo and Zooty to actually *see* them. And to find out that the aliens were all correct - they just aren't funny. At all.

 

[KoshN]

the Walkers at Sigma 927.

Regards,

Joe

Come on, Joe. 927?

 

[PillowRock]

I only found it unrealistic that nobody external (a third party, a curious bystander) showed up to record, measure, watch, reverse-engineer and analyse the event.

Note that (per the Lurker's Guide) the Day of the Dead only occurs once every 200 years. It is entirely plausable that:

A) There had not been one since the Brakiri made contact with other races.

B) No non-Brakiri had ever experianced it before.

C) Non-Brakiri who had heard of it had discounted the stories of contacts as legends / "old wives' tales".

I'm not surprised that no non-Brakiri scientific group had taken it seriously enough to mount an investigation.

And if they *did* then that investigation would have taken place on the Brakiri home world (should that be allowed). Note that it wasn't until the beginning of the episode, *very* shortly before the occurance, that the Brakiri "acquired" the piece of B5 that allowed it to be part of their planet. Therefore, nobody could have planned an investigative trip to B5 (not to mention the fact that I would doubt that any investigator who did take old Brakiri reports seriously, and did know about the temporary buying of part of B5, would almost certainly still not expect the effects to occur on B5).

No, I don't find it at all "unrealistic" that there were no actual investigations into the phenomenon going on on Babylon 5.

 

[GKarsEye]

I kind of dug Rebo & Zooty. Besides being a Pen & Teller fan (but only when they're together, 'cause Pen Jillette is an insufferable ass when he gets the spotlight alone), they just didn't seem funny to us because we never saw the set-ups of any of their jokes, and also because culture will change so much in 260 years.

 

[puzzle]

Note that (per the Lurker's Guide) the Day of the Dead only occurs once every 200 years. It is entirely plausable that:
A) There had not been one since the Brakiri made contact with other races.

Reminds me that I've never noticed if the beginning of Brakiri spaceflight has been assigned a date by any story.

And if they *did* then that investigation would have taken place on the Brakiri home world (should that be allowed).

A good point. At least Brakiri themselves (who'd not consider it an old wives' tale, and of whom some would desire to figure it out) would probably take their chances at crunching the mystery on their homeworld.

I would doubt that any investigator who did take old Brakiri reports seriously, and did know about the temporary buying of part of B5, would almost certainly still not expect the effects to occur on B5).

That's plausible. And information might not travel quickly enough for anyone to respond and collect comparison data on B5 once it started.

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

I kind of dug Rebo & Zooty. Besides being a Pen & Teller fan (but only when they're together, 'cause Pen Jillette is an insufferable ass when he gets the spotlight alone)

So much word to this, GKarsEye.

 

[MMarin]

I have to agree with JMS when talking about Rebo and Zooty. His description brings a valid point to their comedic act.

Neil kept the humor sort of off-base...operating on the assumption that there are some things that become au courant or funny because of context: Steve Martin's "excuuuuse me," for instance. Now, it ain't funny, it's just annoying...at the time, EVERYbody was saying it and laughing. R&Z are similar cultural phenomena...their "with a machine" catchphrase, for instance, which the crowd new and reacted to. To us, and Lochely, it didn't mean anything. Lochley's reaction was tailored to be EXACTLY the same as most women's (and some guy's) reaction to the Three Stooges: either it's funny, or you can't figure out why people are laughing.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Come on, Joe. 927?

Hey, I had minor (outpatient) surgery on both feet Saturday morning, and I've either been in pain (at work) or on pain killers (at home) ever since. I'm surprised I've managed to type my name right as often as I have.

I only found it unrealistic that nobody external (a third party, a curious bystander) showed up to record, measure, watch, reverse-engineer and analyse the event.

Well, Spengler and Stantz were all ready to go, but Venkman stopped them.

Regards,

Joe

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

Hey, I had minor (outpatient) surgery on both feet Saturday morning, and I've either been in pain (at work) or on pain killers (at home) ever since. I'm surprised I've managed to type my name right as often as I have.

Aw, had those sixth toes removed finally, Joe? Seriously though, many healing vibes headed your way, and I hope you feel better soon. Painkillers are a wonderful thing. Got class 2 narcotics, or the lightweight stuff?

Well, Spengler and Stantz were all ready to go, but Venkman stopped them.

Bwah! I think you ought to win the thread when you can shoehorn in a Ghostbusters reference. Nicely done.

Amy

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Aw, had those sixth toes removed finally, Joe?

My sister thnks the (admittedly larger than usual) gap between my big toe and the rest of the toes on each of my feet is freakishly huge, and when we were kids used to tell our friends and neighbors that I'd had an extra toe removed from that spot. I think she was just jealous because she couldn't dial a rotary phone or pick up a key with her feet - skills which I thought would come in handy if we were ever tied up by burglars.

Seriously though, many healing vibes headed your way, and I hope you feel better soon. Painkillers are a wonderful thing. Got class 2 narcotics, or the lightweight stuff?

Tylenol-Codiene threes if you can believe it. And I had to ask the quack for that much. He sent me home with nothing but a presciption for anti-biotics, which I didn't question at the time since my toes were still numb from the anasthetic. But when that wore off a few hours later it felt like somebody had fitted a gom jabber to each foot. I called the office (which had closed), got the answering service which took a message for the doctor on call - who turned out to be my doctor. He called back a couple of hours later and I talked him into writing the scrip. Then I realized that pharmacies don't deliver any more. (There is one in the area that does nothing but deliveries, but you have to open an account in person before they'll accept prescriptions by phone or fax.) So I had to walk down three flights of stairs to my car, drive to the nearest Walgreens, walk to the phramacy counter at the back of ths store, then stand behind Ma Kettle as she balanced her checkbook, sorted all her coupons and change and negotiated a lasting peace betwen the Israelis and Palestinians before she finally got out of my way after picking up her drugs. Then I walked the length of the store again, across the parking lot, drove the five blocks to my place and climbed back up those three flights of stairs before collapsing on the couch and finding out the doctor had not supplied the oxycodone or morphine I had hoped for, but Tyllenol with a little cough suppressent. I compensated by taking two days worth the in the first 18 hours.

I had to come home a couple of hours early yesterday, myfirst full day back on my feet. (And the first wearing footwear of any kind since Saturday. Sneakers. Found out I had over-padded one toe, though, so it was kinda squished most of the day. Really couldn't change the dressing at work.) Today I got in a litle late, just beause everything takes longer when you're limping, but I lasted the whole day, even stayed a little late to finish getting all the network accounts for tomorrow's bi-weekly class of new highers set up on the network.

And thanks for the healing thoughts, I'm sure they'll help.

Joe