JMS hints at some new info...

[AntonyF]

This is a minefield that website owners are forced to navigate, and it's a hard one.

Everything is copyright theft or usage. Using the words Babylon 5, fan fiction, fan games whatever... technically, all a sticky ground. There's fair use, and use that WB may take exception to.

The scripts etc. are definite no nos. They are someone's actual work, and in this case JMS has made his intentions clear.

Things based up, or derived from, B5 are something else. They may not be legally sound, but it goes on a lot. There's so much in the Star Trek fan world that's derived from the show, but is unofficial.

Thus, I will allow links to this game. It's not someone's work they are reproducing, it is something based upon B5.

Naturally, if I got a complaint from WB, I would put a stop to it. But unless that happens, it's okay.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Thus, I will allow links to this game. It's not someone's work they are reproducing, it is something based upon B5.

[/quote]

Fair enough. I know that site owners have to be careful, and wasn't sure exactly where you thought you needed to draw the line. Fan fic the studios all turn a blind eye to, it is inevitable, it isn't worth the time and trouble to fight, and it really doesn't compete with anything they're really doing. (But I have a feeling that they're going to jump on this proposed game with both feet when they hear about it, which they won't do from me, but eventually somebody's going to post something at a site that they monitor.)

Wasn't trying to speak for you, just reasoning by analogy.

Kosh_N:

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I didn't know that absolute completeness was a requirement for all posts.

[/quote]

Of course it is, didn't you get the memo? /forums/images/icons/smile.gif Also spelling and grammar count.

Regards,

Joe

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Joe:

Should Warner devote any attention to something like IFH, this attention would probably express itself in the form of a licensing agreement proposal. Naturally, that would happen only if they would deem it deservant of licensing.

Should their attention be less than constructive, the people involved could officially release a game engine with no trace of B5 implied... just a generic space combat simulator with its model, texture, mission and other file formats published. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

That these model and scenario formats would be uniquely suited for representing the B5 universe... is not basis for legal obstructions. Such things can happen by coincidence. Even if not coincidental, it would still not violate copyright. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Naturally model, mission and other files would be likely to appear on the web soon after. Countless fans making, and some freely distributing their own 3D ship models... is already happening for some time. Nobody is suing them.

In such manner, a computer game uniquely suited for Babylon 5 could become de facto released without any contradiction with copyright law. Some people just made a game. Others added B5 models and missions to play that game.

Now imagine yourself as executive in the company which produced the movie which some of these models & scenarios are based on. Who could you reliably sue? Nobody? Everybody? Suing nobody does not work. Suing everybody doesn't really work either. The situation is very similar to fan fiction... only on different medium.

Not legally correct, but copyright holders tend to look the other way. Because it generally causes no harm... because fighting windmills is inefficient and damaging to public appearance... and lastly because in the long term, any interest in their copyrighted property brings them benefit.

 

[GaribaldisHair]

How come I always jump in with a post when the subject I am talking about has disappeared about 10 posts ago.

Anyway, just a thought, but could this news of interest to a sub-set of B5 fandom be an official announcement of LotR on DVD in the UK by any chance?

As I say ... just a thought.

/forums/images/icons/grin.gif

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Should Warner devote any attention to something like IFH, this attention would probably express itself in the form of a licensing agreement proposal. Naturally, that would happen only if they would deem it deservant of licensing.

[/quote]

If this were a company, or a group of fans who planned to sell the game, I think you'd be right. But since this seems to be a single fan, possibly getting a little help from others, and since he intends to give the final product away, I don't see Warner Bros. negotiating a license agreement with him. Who would pay for the license? How would WB collect royalties on the copies distributed?

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Should their attention be less than constructive, the people involved could officially release a game engine with no trace of B5 implied

[/quote]

Absolutely. But since this is a fan-driven effort with the express purpose of filling the void left by the cancelled Into the Fire, I don't see the point of doing that. (And doubt the creator of the new game would, either.) There are plenty of non-B5 space combat simulators out there. What good does it do the B5 fan community, at whom IFH is aimed, to add another one?

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Anyway, just a thought, but could this news of interest to a sub-set of B5 fandom be an official announcement of LotR on DVD in the UK by any chance?


[/quote]

That's possible. There have been rumors of such a release, including the "upcoming titles" list in TV Zone magazine in the U.K., which for several consecutive issues reported that the disc would arrive on July 22nd. (In which case it would already have been announced.) But in their most recent issue TV Zone has listed the Rangers pilot as "delayed until 2003, date TBA"

It may be something as simple as their having renewed the licensing agreements that lapsed last year, like the one for the card game, now that it is clear that there won't be a new series to jack-up the price.

Regards,

Joe

 

[samuelk]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I don't see Warner Bros. negotiating a license agreement with him. Who would pay for the license? How would WB collect royalties on the copies distributed?

[/quote]

This has happened before. The free Half-Life MOD Counter-Strike was picked up by Valve Software, who created the game for which Counter-Strike was written.

If there's enough fan interest in a freeware game, it can generate corporate interest.

Oh, and just FYI, the freeware game Into the Fire is being developed by more than one B5 fan (I even have a small voice part in the game /forums/images/icons/grin.gif ). It's shaping up to be an absolutely amazing game.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
This has happened before. The free Half-Life MOD Counter-Strike was picked up by Valve Software, who created the game for which Counter-Strike was written.


[/quote]

But that was a software company buying the rights to a modification of one of its own games. Not a TV studio selling the rights to one of its properties to a handful of fans to produce their own game - which they would then give away. Presumably Valve Software turned around and incorporated the fan-mod into later versions of their own game and sold those, so there was money involved. I still don't see where Warner Bros. stands to make any money from IFH, and therefore no reason to think that they'd license it.

Regards,

Joe

 

[GShans]

i just found one reason for WB to go after it, it has a presumably ripped portion from In the Beginning from it, though to the extent of the clip, i cannot say.

 

[Mike G]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
How come I always jump in with a post when the subject I am talking about has disappeared about 10 posts ago.

Anyway, just a thought, but could this news of interest to a sub-set of B5 fandom be an official announcement of LotR on DVD in the UK by any chance?

[/quote]

It seems that way quite a bit around here.

Anyway, I think that it could be an anouncement about some of the other TV movies coming out on DVD, maybe even Rangers .

 

[KoshN]

JMS just wants to see us all guessing. We are sooooo predictable. /forums/images/icons/blush.gif

 

[Chilli]

JMS is a sadist at heart..
I dunno what it would be.. A new book/trilogy? WB would not have anything to do with that would they?

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
JMS is a sadist at heart...

[/quote]

No more calls, please; we have a winner. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I dunno what it would be... A new book/trilogy?

[/quote]

Not according to JMS's previous posts and comments from Steve Saffel at Del Rey. They both say that there are no other books in the works at this time.

Regards,

Joe

 

[FlipperPA]

This may be a pipedream, but I'd like to see them redo the graphics from Season 1 and perhaps the beginning of Season 2. Also, perhaps they're considering including the original version of the Gathering for a laugh? Invoking privacy now!

Another thing I'd like them to do is kill of Jinxo from Grail. /forums/images/icons/grin.gif

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Another thing I'd like them to do is kill of Jinxo from Grail. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

[/quote]

Be careful what you wish for. They could use CGI to replace him with Jar-Jar, and then where would be be? And yes, your other idea is a pipe-dream. /forums/images/icons/grin.gif

Regards,

Joe

 

[samuelk]

One thing to keep in mind is that he said this announcement would be of interest to a "small subset" of B5 fans. I don't think releasing the other shows/movies on DVD would fall under that category.

Personally, I think they're going to announce more novels, or maybe a computer game....

 

[Recoil]

Time to put your money down folks.

Mine is on the DVD release. It really is the only thing that makes sense.

 

[samuelk]

How would the DVD release be of interest to only a "small subset" of B5 fans?

Besides, JMS said he couldn't say anything about it, yet he's already talked about the DVDs. Now that the word is out, there's really no reason why he couldn't say when WB was going to officially announce them.

 

[Recoil]

As has been described before:

1) Not ALL B5 fans may be interested in the DVD release, or even HAVE DVD players.

2) Also, JMS has talked about the DVD's because the cat is out of the bag, but that doesnt mean he can speak to what he KNOWS WB's press release to be about. They would probably frown on that.

3) There REALLY is no other possibility that WB would have to talk ABOUT. They have nothing to do with books. They wouldnt be announcing a series or TV movie for B5 --- that would come from the actual NETWORKS that would broadcast it most likely. So really, the DVD's from WB are the only realistic option.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Just to recap for those joining us late (especially the ones too busy to read all the earlier posts in this thread):

JMS didn't say anything about "a small subset of fans" He said that there was a "small announcement" coming from Warner Bros. that would be of interest "to a certain subset of fans."

He also said this announcement was not anything major like a new TV movie or series.

Within the past 30 or 40 days both JMS and Del Rey books have reiterated that there are no new books in the works.

As Recoil correctly noted, DVD owners constitute a "sub-set" of B5 fans because not all fans own DVD players.

As Recoil also correctly noted, the post from the National Captioning revealed that the DVDs are coming, which freed JMS to comment on the subject - but that doesn't mean that he can divulge the contents of a Warner Bros. press release before they issue it. There is a protocol to these things, and that would violate it.

CCG game players and general collectors also constitute "a certain sub-set" of B5 fans, so the other possibility is that WB will announce that it is renewing some of the licensing agreements for B5 merchandise that it allowed to lapse last year.

Remember, the announcement was characterized as "small". Licensing renewals could fit that description, since that would just mean previous projects are resuming after an interruption. So would the official announcement of the DVDs, since it has been widely reported since March that the first season discs were coming this fall, and JMS has been giving out details on the release for several weeks.

But it seems to me that announcing additional TV movies on home video or anything else along those lines would be a "big" announcement, since at this point WB hasn't even given us the official word on S1. (And JMS hasn't even hinted that anything beyond S1 is currently in the works - which it probably wouldn't be since WB will want to see how S1 sells before committing any more money to B5 DVDs.)

Oh well, we'll know one way or the other in the next couple of weeks. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif Boy, can we chew the marrow out of the smallest bone he tosses us, or what? /forums/images/icons/grin.gif

Regards,

Joe

 

[GShans]

just a dream, but he could of lied about the "small" part, just to decieve us. Dream over.