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Let me end the silence...(some spoilers)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Yes, it is. Because it wasn't an established series, it was a new series. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But still a series. Rangers is a TV movie.

See? "Series", "Movie". "Apple", "Orange"

And you don't take a ratings powerhouse like E.R. and put it up against a national fad like Millionaire. Not if you aren't an idiot, you don't. That just costs you millions of dollars in ad revenue in the timeslot that E.R. normally wins and costs you a lot of prestige, to boot.

The two situations are not remotely comparable, not in the real world.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division

joseph-demartino@att.net
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
But still a series. Rangers is a TV movie.

See? "Series", "Movie". "Apple", "Orange"

And you don't take a ratings powerhouse like E.R. and put it up against a national fad like Millionaire. Not if you aren't an idiot, you don't. That just costs you millions of dollars in ad revenue in the timeslot that E.R. normally wins and costs you a lot of prestige, to boot.

The two situations are not remotely comparable, not in the real world.

Regards,

Joe

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The premise in both situations is that what is sitting there needs ratings. In one case, it's a one time event and in the other, a weekly. But the basic premise is the same.

Do you SERIOUSLY want to suggest that putting a new, unknown series onto the same timeslot than a show that sweeps the streets clean of people with everyone sitting in front of their TV is a good way to get people to watch it?

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If I tell you my name is Lorien, what good is that?

(Whatever happened to Mr. Garibaldi?)
 
Man, am I joining this thread late in the game or what. Anyway...

Dylan, Warren, Alex, and the rest of the actors, you guys are great. I think it's awesome that you guys come here. If I've interpreted your messages correctly in the past, you guys considered B5LR more than just a job, at least partially because of fan support here, but with you posting here and talking to the fans, I think it makes us view the movie as more than just a movie too.

There's a nice reciprocation (sp?) process going on here that I think is pretty special. Does this kind of thing go on with other shows--especially ones that haven't even gotten the guarantee that they will be a show? I'm guessing it doesn't happen often.

Joe D said...
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> (If I'd been a Neilsen household they would have shown me watching both the 9 PM and 11 PM airings, because I went back and watched it again after this site crashed. ) <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm the same way. I watched it very closely, undistracted, in my living room at 9PM and then tried to get into this site in my "computer room" while I watched it again at 11PM. I can't remember for sure, but I think I may have also watched the tape of it a day or two later. I wish I were a Neilsen household. I never watch sports. I didn't know there was a game that night.
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Despite any nitpicks that may have appeared here, overall, I think the majority believe you guys have the potential for a series, and you deserve it. Good luck. I'll visit the Scifi.com site now and see if I can add my 2 cents in the message campaign.

Thanks for the work, and I hope to see more of it soon.

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An Old Egyptian Blessing: May God stand between you and harm in all the empty places that you must walk.

Thoughts & prayers to soldiers fighting overseas and to their families.
 
Thanks for the addresses. I truly enjoyed the telemovie and would love to see it continue as a series. The chemistry between the cast worked quite well. JMS and company need to be given a chance to let this story come to fruition.

Good luck and cherry blossoms!

Sakka

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"If god is the author of all life, then why am I still working on character development?"
 
Fellow B5 fans: I am optimistic dammit!!! And, I hope you start feeling more of the same.
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I've never seen a demographics/psychographics breakdown of B5. Shooting from the hip, I'd say that it is very male-dominated. I don't mean to offend women by saying this. At the risk of sounding still more sexist, I believe that men are considerably more prone to watch NFL football. Further, in the weeks prior to the 19th, I was commenting on several occassions how I was disappointed that I hadn't seen a football game this season with a lot of snow in it.

Such games harken back to when we were kids/teenagers, playing tackle football in the snow. For me, this brings up terrific memories, such as a snow fall of 26 inches with thunder. We played an exhausting game and didn't feel the cold until the slow walk home from the football field.

While flipping back to the game during B5LR commercial breaks, I was EXTREMELY tempted to watch this game. If I hadn't been recording B5LR for my grandmother, I would have recorded the game...an AWESOME GAME!!!

Anyway, this game nailed the B5LR demographic/psychographic where it hurts!!! I SUSPECT that the other cable shows that faired better than B5LR derived their ratings because that is where most of the women that didn't want to watch football or anything SciFi went. Again, I don't mean to insult the women among us by implying that they are in the minority with respect to their gender's viewing habits. As far as I am concerned, this makes them more special and interesting. My last girlfriend hated SciFi and that was a problem.

Also, the over forty-something crowd, particularly married, probably made their selections as a matter of compromise between what he wants and what she wants. I'm fairly confident those compromises would not involve football and most assuredly no Sci-Fi.

So, the bottom line is this, the football game snowed-out any semblance of normalized ratings inferences. They're all skewed.

Actually, Sci-Fi's new owners might be considering a bigger question. Can sci-fi ever go head to head with major prime time events? The 19th suggests that it cannot.

Sci-fi may have been trying to grow its niche market with B5LR, given the extraordinary promotions. So, while the ratings for B5LR may disappoint SciFi with respect to B5LR, from now on, going to head-to-head with such events will give the sponsors pause, which will surely give the executives pause. This means that the SciFi channel may keep its powder dry during major prime time events; better to fight another day.

Consider two SciFi Channel pieces of content. One that would generate relatively great ratings and one that would generate ho hum ratings (pull out an old stock of some movie from who knows when and where)! If you air the 'great' one against a major prime time event and the stock film another time versus airing the stock film against the major prime time event and the 'great' one another time, the second approach would yield a much greater sum of ratings.

So does this experience spell the doom for a B5LR series? Hell no!!!

Look at some of the other SciFi channel shows that have come and gone and even some of those that are hanging on. You see, this is the real competition, can B5LR do better than what the SciFi channel has done and is doing with respect to the other series? Of course it can!!! In fact, I'd say Farscape is the only real competitor. If you were a SciFi channel executive, would you like to invest in Farscape and a series (B5LR) that will do as good or better than Farscape? Or, would you invest in Farscape and something completely different, untested, unknown, and in the context of quite a few ho hum shows that Sci Fi channel has invested in the past and presently?

Chin up folks, we're going to get a B5LR series. The $$$ will work in our favor.

The greatest danger is that they may provide a smaller budget in the early episodes if their current (based on the 19th) net present value estimates aren't fat enough. This could yield a lesser showing and hence yield a shorter run for B5LR. But, I have faith in JMS compensating for this by placing less emphasis on CGI and maybe having fewer guest actors (perhaps some of the regulars might be asked to put on alien costumes in lieu of guest actors). JMS can make it work.

I'm excited!!! I hope you feel it too. Let's storm the halls of the influencers and decision-makers with our letters ablaze. Faith manages!!!

Cheers,

Eirik



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It never ends; it only changes!

[This message has been edited by eirik (edited January 25, 2002).]
 
B5 has seen tougher, more uncertain days than this... especially the end of season 4.

I'm focused on the success of this show 200%. (Any more and I would have to take attention away from my own heartbeat, and that wouldn't be a Good Thing.)
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OK, so I'm exaggerating... but only slightly...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>"Faith sustains us in the hour when reason tells us we cannot continue..."

"Faith and reason are the shoes on your feet! You can travel further with both than with just one."

The Deconstruction of Falling Stars, Babylon 5<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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-Londo's Hair
"Vir, intelligence has nothing to do with politics!"
 
Dylan,

Thanks for the info. It was nice of you to give us an idea of where things might be with the movie and the possiblity of a series. It's too bad that football was on opposite the movie. If I am correct, that game shouldn't have been played because there is usually a week off before the Super Bowl, Since the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11th put the season off for a week, they did away with that extra week off in order to try to keep the Super Bowl on schedule. Now, I'm not sure if the weekend of the 19th would have been that off week, but it could possibily have been. Scifi could never have predicted that New York and Washington would be hit and that because of that, football would compete with the movie.

I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. Maybe they will run the movie again at a time when there is nothing like football to interfere. If not, I hope they will still consider giving Rangers a chance.

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Dulann: You don't solve your problems by hitting them.
David Martel: Yeah, well, it made me feel better.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dylan Neal:
Basically we got destroyed by the football game. . . . I don't know whether the network was aware of the game when it first decided on the 19th, but that game was the highest rated game in over FIVE years!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think this is the first year the networks put NFL playoff games on a Saturday night. It was an experiment to see if it helped the football ratings, and no one was quite sure how it would work out . . . I guess now we know.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Now where do we go from here? I am not saying that all is lost by any means! The network is aware of all of this and if I know Doug Netter, he is pitching statistics right left and center in an attempt to make sure the network and studio see the clear picture here. When all the numbers are released I think there will be some good things in there along with the bad. There are many ways to break down Nielsen stats, and I'm sure that is what the network is doing right now.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think the good news from the West Coast will be helpful. Also, I wonder how the ratings progressed as the movie went on. If the ratings held steady or improved as the film progressed, that would indicate that the movie held people's interest and was able to attract viewers who may have been channel surfing. That would be good news, and might help you guys make the case.

And let me just throw in here, I sure as heck hope you do make that case. I want to see more of you folks in action, because you did a fine job coming out of the gate.

Take care, and best wishes.

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Dave Thomer
This Is Not News
 
Dave is right. One of the important stats is whether the audience Grows or Shrinks while the movie is running.

An audience that Grows says that channel surfers and people who got home Late are tuning in and that the audience that started the movie is Staying.

A Shrinking audience means that the movie bored its audience enough to send them channel surfing.

This stat can be More important to the decision than the total at times.
Especially this time, we hope.

Oh, judging by my own observations of Babylon 5 fans at conventions and whatnot, the Female demographic is more than 40% of the audience.
I've seen some Cons where there were More females than males checking out Babylon 5 panels.
Of course, some of them may just have the hots for Marcus & Franklin...

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Do not ascribe your own motivations to others:
At best, it will break your heart.
At worst, it will get you dead."
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Is there any chance WB might shop around for another network, though?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>




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My wife can't stand a minute of Star Trek (even if I tried very hard). But she's a totally B5-addict, and Delenn-addict.

The only glitch was with Legend of Rangers. She was unable to forget Dylan' character in Bold & Beautiful.

( But hey ! the first few episodes of season 2 she was unable to forget Boxleitner as Scarecrow too...
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)

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---------------------------------
When I said my quarters were cold, I did not mean "Oh, I think it is a little chilly in here. Perhaps I'll throw a blanket on the bed." No! I said it was cold! As in, "Oh look - my left arm has snapped off like an icicle and shattered on the floor!"
- Londo
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dylan Neal:

wink.gif
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<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey Dylan ! What was that answer mean ??? Do you have some privilegied informations that you may want to share with us ???
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When I said my quarters were cold, I did not mean "Oh, I think it is a little chilly in here. Perhaps I'll throw a blanket on the bed." No! I said it was cold! As in, "Oh look - my left arm has snapped off like an icicle and shattered on the floor!"
- Londo


[This message has been edited by GaribaldiHairs (edited January 26, 2002).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
(I don't count UPN as a major network, and besides, Trek in some form has been their flagship show since the network was launched. Unique situation.)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

UPN would be a great lead-out show for Enterprise though.... two very dedicated fan bases, to very sci-fi shows.




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MPAA: Rated R for bad language, crude humor,
language, sexuality/nudity and drug content.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dark Lord:
Why does this all seem so familiar....?
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Lorien was wrong.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Never seen you this down since the whole rebuf of the near C partical beams
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Yes this is a setback. Yes it was bad luck. BUt half the people here are acting as if the future is written. Its not (unless this is the Voyager universe in which case we are doomed, DOOMED!)

Errhm (gets under control)

What was it that Lenier said in Atonement? That he would take whatever comes no matter what. Looks like as good a phrase as any.
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I am a full-time lurker on this forum, mainly because I'm a full-time poster on another one ... but let me say this ...

FAITH ... FAITH ... FAITH ... FAITH ... FAITH

To those with their heads high, kudos ... to those who are unsure about where this is heading, have faith. Don't question how or why ... just write the letters, make the calls, and send the e-mails. B5 fans and Star Trek fans love to throw mud at each other, but the simple fact is, we brought Star Trek back from the grave multiple times, and we brought B5 out of the abyss countless times. Crusade was doomed for failure and beyond our control, but Rangers is NOT. You don't just fight the fights you can win, but you fight the fights worth fighting ... and this is one of them ... it's a war between good television and the derivitive trash we're constantly spoonfed by the networks.

Situations like this remind me of a SportsNight episode (another of the TV greats squeezed out by short-sighted execs) where Natalie is deciding to go public with the assault from a football star ... "this is what friends gear up for." Well, this is what we're here for. jms (and everyone else involved) haven given their blood, their sweat, their tears, and their lives so that we could experience one of the most incredible epic stories ever put together. We did our part once before ... we need to do it again. No "I'm not holding out much hope" or "I'm not going to send a letter because it won't matter." Faith. Faith. Faith. Believe Rangers is going to series, and then MAKE it happen. MAKE IT HAPPEN!

das

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I guess it's officially safe to say that along with 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia' and 'Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line,' we can add 'Never schedule your back door pilot against the NFL playoffs when a series is on the line' to the list of classic blunders.

On the other hand, if you'd told me in mid 2000 that we'd have a new B5 movie and the chance for a new series, I probably would have asked you to send five pounds of whatever you were smoking to my house. So all hope is not lost.

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Dave Thomer
This Is Not News
 
Well, I watched all three showings on the SciFi channel last weekend, trying to do my part for the cause.

I'm not sure SciFi could have anticipated the NFL moving playoff games to a primetime slot on Saturday. Even once they knew, it was probably too late to pull back all their promotional activities (remember, none of this happens in a vaccuum). Further, as for any demographic versus (American) football here in the U.S., remember the "Heidi" game...

Maybe I'm remembering this wrong, but didn't that game run past 11PM (in the East, at least)? And, it was a good game, at that...

Like everyone else, I am saddened by this turn of events; but hope for the best!



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"What's up, Drakh?"

Michael Garibaldi
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GaribaldiHairs:
Hey Dylan ! What was that answer mean ??? Do you have some privilegied informations that you may want to share with us ???
wink.gif


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

He's not saying anything. He did not say anything then, and he's not saying anything now.
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But what a fun thing it is to guess.

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It's like I've always said, you can get more with a kind word and a 2 by 4 than you can with just a kind word.
 
Gee, I wonder if Dylan is trying to tell us something with his winking and sunglass smileys.
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I do remember him mentioning that if Sci Fi doesn't make a series out of Rangers, then maybe Warner Bros. will shop it around. Maybe they are already looking into doing that.
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Dulann: You don't solve your problems by hitting them.
David Martel: Yeah, well, it made me feel better.
 
Sure seems like Dylan knows something and it's not all bad.
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Even though Joe DeMartino made some very good points (as always!) as far as the possible networks are concerned, I guess that WB must still see some possibilities even if SciFi decided to not go for a series.

Of course, it would be great if SciFi saw sense and gave Rangers a green light... well, in any case, there's still plenty of hope left.
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"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com
 

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