-
The new B5TV.COM is here. We've replaced our 16 year old software with flashy new XenForo install. Registration is open again. Password resets will work again. More info here.
No Show. Why not books?
- Thread starter ElScorcho
- Start date
Joseph DeMartino
Moderator
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
I always thought that the plug was pulled on Crusade because TNT were interfeering too much and handing down requests for more violence or whatever et. etc.
[/quote]
No, that was pretty much it. They demanded those things, JMS refused, the show was cancelled. What we were discussing above was not why TNT cancelled (or aborted) the show, but why The Sci-Fi Channel didn't pick it up immediately after the production halt in January 1999.
Regards,
Joe
I always thought that the plug was pulled on Crusade because TNT were interfeering too much and handing down requests for more violence or whatever et. etc.
[/quote]
No, that was pretty much it. They demanded those things, JMS refused, the show was cancelled. What we were discussing above was not why TNT cancelled (or aborted) the show, but why The Sci-Fi Channel didn't pick it up immediately after the production halt in January 1999.
Regards,
Joe
Right, I thought so. Its just that some people were saying things like "TNT did not want cursade" and that if it had gotten better rating they might have kept it.
These dont seem to apply seen as JMS pulled the plug himself. I see now that people meant that if it had gotten better ratings, TNT would not have interfered as much and therefore it would not have been aborted.
Looks like understanding is a three-edged sword after all.
These dont seem to apply seen as JMS pulled the plug himself. I see now that people meant that if it had gotten better ratings, TNT would not have interfered as much and therefore it would not have been aborted.
Looks like understanding is a three-edged sword after all.
KoshN
Super Moderator
Why do you keep saying "JMS pulled the plug himself" ? TNT pulled the plug. TNT canceled Crusade. Crusade was not JMS's to cancel.
True, JMS once walked off the show (in disgust at TNT-Atlanta's continuous interference), but he came back. TNT could have tried to continue the show without him, by getting other writers. I'm not saying they'd have succeeded, but they could have tried that route. JMS's walking off the show wouldn't cancel it.
What I want to know is why The Sci-Fi Channel didn't re-start Crusade AFTER they finally got the re-run rights. Why do they pick up the re-run rights to shows that were canceled in mid-stride (e.g. Crusade, Brimstone, etc.), with absolutely no intention of filming new episodes? Do they think that people like unfinished stories, bridges to nowhere??? /forums/images/icons/confused.gif /forums/images/icons/confused.gif /forums/images/icons/confused.gif
Example: I recently was trying to convince someone I know to watch Brimstone. It's her kind of show. She'd like it. I know she would. She was interested. However, as soon as I told her that there were only 13 episodes, and that Sci-Fi was only re-running the existing 13 episodes, she wasn't interested. If people know the show is going nowhere, that it's a dead end, they won't watch, unless you call it a miniseries (and then you're lying since nothing is resolved). It's a truncation, not a planned ending.
True, JMS once walked off the show (in disgust at TNT-Atlanta's continuous interference), but he came back. TNT could have tried to continue the show without him, by getting other writers. I'm not saying they'd have succeeded, but they could have tried that route. JMS's walking off the show wouldn't cancel it.
What I want to know is why The Sci-Fi Channel didn't re-start Crusade AFTER they finally got the re-run rights. Why do they pick up the re-run rights to shows that were canceled in mid-stride (e.g. Crusade, Brimstone, etc.), with absolutely no intention of filming new episodes? Do they think that people like unfinished stories, bridges to nowhere??? /forums/images/icons/confused.gif /forums/images/icons/confused.gif /forums/images/icons/confused.gif
Example: I recently was trying to convince someone I know to watch Brimstone. It's her kind of show. She'd like it. I know she would. She was interested. However, as soon as I told her that there were only 13 episodes, and that Sci-Fi was only re-running the existing 13 episodes, she wasn't interested. If people know the show is going nowhere, that it's a dead end, they won't watch, unless you call it a miniseries (and then you're lying since nothing is resolved). It's a truncation, not a planned ending.
hypatia
Regular
About Crusade: perhaps Sci-Fi had already begun moving towards its "less space/alien, more cheap crap" policy already. But for Brimstone, I don't know. I don't know much about Brimstone, but it certainly was not space-based, I think.
I don't know. But I, too, am just getting sick of starting in on a new series to find that the stations just don't have the patience to let a show become a success.
I think I read somewhere last week that MASH didn't get great ratings in its first season. But a change in day/time proved to bring the ratings up.
Can you imagine it if MASH had been cancelled after one season? /forums/images/icons/rolleyes.gif
I don't know. But I, too, am just getting sick of starting in on a new series to find that the stations just don't have the patience to let a show become a success.
I think I read somewhere last week that MASH didn't get great ratings in its first season. But a change in day/time proved to bring the ratings up.
Can you imagine it if MASH had been cancelled after one season? /forums/images/icons/rolleyes.gif
KoshN
Super Moderator
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino: </font color>
No, that was pretty much it. They demanded those things, JMS refused, the show was canceled.
[/quote]
Well, JMS gave in to their demands in some areas, just not in all areas. In some places he refused to budge. (...and good for JMS! /forums/images/icons/grin.gif )
In part, TNT canceled because they didn't get their way all the time with JMS, because JMS stood up to them (and so he and his show had to go), and in part because Crusade didn't fit their network (Most people either tuned in for Crusade and then left immediately afterward, or they tuned out when Crusade came on, and then came back afterward.). There was supposedly very little overlap with their existing audience, and so Crusade was not a good fit for thier channel. This is not something that The Sci-Fi Channel can say.
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino: </font color>
No, that was pretty much it. They demanded those things, JMS refused, the show was canceled.
[/quote]
Well, JMS gave in to their demands in some areas, just not in all areas. In some places he refused to budge. (...and good for JMS! /forums/images/icons/grin.gif )
In part, TNT canceled because they didn't get their way all the time with JMS, because JMS stood up to them (and so he and his show had to go), and in part because Crusade didn't fit their network (Most people either tuned in for Crusade and then left immediately afterward, or they tuned out when Crusade came on, and then came back afterward.). There was supposedly very little overlap with their existing audience, and so Crusade was not a good fit for thier channel. This is not something that The Sci-Fi Channel can say.
KoshN this is about the truest (sp) statement I have ever seen:
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
She'd like it. I know she would. She was interested. However, as soon as I told her that there were only 13 episodes, and that Sci-Fi was only re-running the existing 13 episodes, she wasn't interested. If people know the show is going nowhere, that it's a dead end, they won't watch,
[/quote]
Cerberus
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
She'd like it. I know she would. She was interested. However, as soon as I told her that there were only 13 episodes, and that Sci-Fi was only re-running the existing 13 episodes, she wasn't interested. If people know the show is going nowhere, that it's a dead end, they won't watch,
[/quote]
Cerberus
KoshN
Super Moderator
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by hypatia: </font color>
About Crusade: perhaps Sci-Fi had already begun moving towards its "less space/alien, more cheap crap" policy already.
[/quote]
Then why go for the re-run rights to either Babylon 5 or Crusade??? Sci-Fi's actions just don't make any sense.
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by hypatia: </font color>
About Crusade: perhaps Sci-Fi had already begun moving towards its "less space/alien, more cheap crap" policy already.
[/quote]
Then why go for the re-run rights to either Babylon 5 or Crusade??? Sci-Fi's actions just don't make any sense.
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
You should remember that Sci-Fi Channel recently changed owners, and that may have further undermined their ability to orient themselves. After all, the parent company is Vivendi Universal, and they also produce movies.
Being unwise, they might demand that productions with their involvement be fit it. About this I cannot be sure, unfamiliar with Sci-Fi schedule and recent trends within it. Perhaps the parent company wants its productions shown, but is only capable of producing mediocrity?
Being unwise, they might demand that productions with their involvement be fit it. About this I cannot be sure, unfamiliar with Sci-Fi schedule and recent trends within it. Perhaps the parent company wants its productions shown, but is only capable of producing mediocrity?
KoshN
Super Moderator
Their sister channel USA, has the excellent "The Dead Zone" and "Monk."
Note how USA:
<ul type="square">[*] Bought more than just one backdoor pilot.
[*] Re-airs each episode several times during the week the episode first aired (so if you miss it, or if there's a power failure, you're not screwed).
[*] Promotes the shows. Check out their websites. Great stuff!
[/list]
Note how USA:
<ul type="square">[*] Bought more than just one backdoor pilot.
[*] Re-airs each episode several times during the week the episode first aired (so if you miss it, or if there's a power failure, you're not screwed).
[*] Promotes the shows. Check out their websites. Great stuff!
[/list]
So, does anyone else think that the scene with Dr. Eilerson's porn data chrystal was put in when TNT demanded "more sex"?
TNT: We said more sex, damnit!
JMS: I put in characters watching porn. How many other SF TV drams have that?
TNT: Yes, but the porn was <checks notes> a ... Pak'ma'ra in S&M gear ... not exactly what we were going for.
/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif
KoshN
Super Moderator
</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by gangster: </font color>
Unfortunately, probably right on the money.
[/quote]
In that case, the channel's dead. It just doesn't know it yet. They're stumbling along, sputtering like a car that's almost out of gas. They're got no new ideas of their own, and instead turn to remakes of ideas that already have been exhausted in the movies, or remakes of tired old cheesy TV shows, or in new attempts to ride the latest fad.
Can't they see that it'd be possible to make a success out of something that another network had clearly bungled (taking what somebody else had already done and established, and leveraging their work instead of starting from square 1), and that there might be demand for resolution (of threads that were truncated and left hanging) by the fans who would re-watch the episodes of say Crusade and Brimstone? Such fans would likely be evangelists who would bring in new fans and help grow the shows. Word of new episodes would stir up much needed buzz, and bring in new fans.
<font color="yellow"> Originally posted by gangster: </font color>
Unfortunately, probably right on the money.
[/quote]
In that case, the channel's dead. It just doesn't know it yet. They're stumbling along, sputtering like a car that's almost out of gas. They're got no new ideas of their own, and instead turn to remakes of ideas that already have been exhausted in the movies, or remakes of tired old cheesy TV shows, or in new attempts to ride the latest fad.
Can't they see that it'd be possible to make a success out of something that another network had clearly bungled (taking what somebody else had already done and established, and leveraging their work instead of starting from square 1), and that there might be demand for resolution (of threads that were truncated and left hanging) by the fans who would re-watch the episodes of say Crusade and Brimstone? Such fans would likely be evangelists who would bring in new fans and help grow the shows. Word of new episodes would stir up much needed buzz, and bring in new fans.
hypatia
Regular
Could they be banking on their miniseries giving them a ratings push? That's one thing I would think that advertisers would be wise to, though. I'll be there watching their second miniseries based on "Dune". But that'll probably be about it. My question is: can the Sci-Fi channel impress advertisers with ratings on a mini-series, when many of us will NOT be back to watch anything else on that channel?
Just curious, I really don't understand the ratings game at all.
Just curious, I really don't understand the ratings game at all.
Now I don't live in America so I don't know much about all your networks and what they've been up to, but I always read that JMS refuse to go along with all TNT's outragous demands so said he wouldn't do it anymore.
Now I'm not sure, but Joe DeMartino pretty much confirmed that so that's why I kept saying "JMS pulled the plug". If this was not the case, then please tell me the full story.
I believe I asked this question further up, and the only one who replied was JD saying I was essentially correct. I obviously don't know the full story because I don't live in the US, so please feel free to enlighten me.
Now I'm not sure, but Joe DeMartino pretty much confirmed that so that's why I kept saying "JMS pulled the plug". If this was not the case, then please tell me the full story.
I believe I asked this question further up, and the only one who replied was JD saying I was essentially correct. I obviously don't know the full story because I don't live in the US, so please feel free to enlighten me.
