Triluminary Question

[Recoil]

So rewatching the series again, a nagging question came up and I don't remember where I heard this particular bit of info. Spoilers below for the, well, no one who is reading this site who hasn't seen B5 all the way through yet.

We know a few things. The Triluminary glowed when the Minbari held it in front of Sinclair. Early in the series (season 1, early season 2) it was stated that this was because he had a "Minbari Soul." Later in the series, this was corrected / modified a bit to show that it actually meant he had the Soul of Valen, not just any Minbari Soul. We also know the Sinclair went back in time and actually WAS Valen.

So the question is, I remember hearing somewhere that the metal chip looking thing in the middle of the Triluminary was actually a piece of Sinclair s Comlink that he wore on his hand when a part of Earthforce. And that pieces of that Comlink were on the other two Triluminaries as well. And, that the reason the Triliminary glowed when held up to him as those Comlinks are genetically bonded to the owners, and it was reacting to his DNA. The question is ---- this was never actually stated in the series itself. Where the hell did I hear this? Was it established in a book as canon? A comic? One of the many JMS Speaks where he was giving backstory that never made it onto film? Its bugging me where I heard this...

 

[KoshN]

What you said sounds reasonable. You could ask JMS on rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated .

 

[Kara Baxter]

delenn said it when she went thru the dream world.

She said it to the minbari who was saying she couldn't marry sheridan, and delen explains all this.

 

[Recoil]

What you said sounds reasonable. You could ask JMS on rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated .

The thing is, I don't think its just a theory of mine. I swear its either canon that wasn't in the show but was mentioned somewhere else, or that JMS already DID mention it on the moderated forum. I'm just trying to remember where I heard it.

Not sure asking him a 12 year old question of something he may have already answered is best. I'm hoping some of the old schoolers around here might remember or have insights. But we will see

Kara --- Delenn does mention that Sinclair has the soul of Valen in that episode, and it is mentioned again in "In the Beginning." But they dont mention that the Triluminary is made out of pieces of Sinclairs Comlink. Thats the part I'm trying to remember where I heard it.

 

[Kara Baxter]

http://jmsnews.com/forums/showthread.php?p=41125

 

[Jan]

I've never heard the comlink theory but I'm pretty sure it's nothing linked to Sinclair since JMS has said:
As will be noted in an upcoming episode, the Triluminaries originally came from Epsilon 3 with the other equipment brought aboard by Zathras.
and

> How exactly does the triluminary thingy come into existence?
> Paradox, no?

It originated on Epsilon 3.

Jan

 

[KoshN]

delenn said it when she went thru the dream world.

She said it to the minbari who was saying she couldn't marry sheridan, and delen explains all this.

About the chip/fragment in the center of the Triluminary being a piece of Sinclair's comm-link?

 

[Jan]

delenn said it when she went thru the dream world.

She said it to the minbari who was saying she couldn't marry sheridan, and delen explains all this.

About the chip/fragment in the center of the Triluminary being a piece of Sinclair's comm-link?

No, there's definitely nothing about the physical construction of the Triluminary on the show itself.

Jan

 

[Recoil]

I looked a couple of the links given above. JMS definitely says that it came from Epsilon 3, but doesn't give any details about it. In the thread Kara posted there is a rather large debate on what it is, and the Comlink theory is mentioned several times there, so apparently I'm not the only person with this in my head. I never surfed the JMS forums though so I'm not sure where I got the idea.

Either way, it appears that its pretty inconclusive. I don't see where JMS said it ISN'T a comlink and its clearly something that's up for some debate. To me that makes a ton of sense --- even if it did come from Epsilon 3 --- but it doesn't seem to be something thats been conclusively answered by JMS or in any books/comics that I can see so far.

 

[Jan]

The only way I could see that any portion of it might be a comlink would be if we'd ever seen any sort of comlink in use by anybody we saw on Epsilon 3. We didn't. Holographic techology, yes, but no sign of anything resembling a comlink.

We also never saw any sign that Sinclair had left behind a comlink that might have been used to construct the triluminary. So if it were a piece of a comlink and it was supposed to be linked to Sinclair then how'd that happen, given that JMS clearly states that they originally came from Epsilon 3.

It's not as if the 'soul link' is the only mysterious property the triluminaries have. They also can knock out guards and leave no memory of it behind. Links can't do that.

Jan

 

[Recoil]

I guess anything is possible at this point. This show, for the most part, was pretty tightly written and almost all things add up, but there have been several details from Season 1 that were "changed" in later seasons as the story evolved, so maybe that's why the Triluminary was never completely explained in the show. Left open to be a mystery and see what facts can be debated, which seems to be taking place. Maybe things changed from the initial concept, who knows.

 

[Kara Baxter]

i think what i found when looking for your answer, cus hey, it got me curious too! LOL

is that the com link is a theory by the fans

the triluminary came from Epsolon 3..then went back in time, to go forward in time...

and that the triluminary contains Sinclair's dna.

JMS did use a lot of 'mystery' when he did/didn't explain stuff.

 

[KoshN]

I looked a couple of the links given above. JMS definitely says that it came from Epsilon 3, but doesn't give any details about it. In the thread Kara posted there is a rather large debate on what it is, and the Comlink theory is mentioned several times there, so apparently I'm not the only person with this in my head. I never surfed the JMS forums though so I'm not sure where I got the idea.

Either way, it appears that its pretty inconclusive. I don't see where JMS said it ISN'T a comlink and its clearly something that's up for some debate. To me that makes a ton of sense --- even if it did come from Epsilon 3 --- but it doesn't seem to be something thats been conclusively answered by JMS or in any books/comics that I can see so far.

Sinclair could have been wearing the commlink when he went back in time to change into Valen. It's entirely possible that during that Minbari & Vorlons vs. Shadow war, that it was among Sinclair's/Valen's possessions and got broken. Over the course of time, the pieces could have made it to Epsilon 3, and the triluminaries constructed (almost certainly with Vorlon help/advice).

Originally, I'd never looked very closely at the center section of a triluminary, and sort of assumed that part was a piece of bone from Sinclair/Valen.

The only way I could see that any portion of it might be a comlink would be if we'd ever seen any sort of comlink in use by anybody we saw on Epsilon 3. We didn't. Holographic techology, yes, but no sign of anything resembling a comlink.

Why? He was probably wearing it when he went back in time, and took it off before he used the triluminary to change from Sinclair to Valen. So. those bits of the commlink, a B5 Earthforce standard issue item, could have been constructed in the 2250s, taken back in time, and resurfaced in the 2250s.

We also never saw any sign that Sinclair had left behind a comlink that might have been used to construct the triluminary.

No big deal.. We haven't seen everything. It would have been understandable though, kind of like how you wear a watch; you don't think about it.

So if it were a piece of a comlink and it was supposed to be linked to Sinclair then how'd that happen, given that JMS clearly states that they originally came from Epsilon 3.

See above.

It's not as if the 'soul link' is the only mysterious property the triluminaries have. They also can knock out guards and leave no memory of it behind. Links can't do that.

Jan

Vorlon tampered links probably could. Think of Sebastian's cane.

 

[Jan]

I guess everybody has to believe what they want. I'll simply point out that A) we see the triluminary clearly when Sinclair begins the cocoon effect and the center piece of the triluminary is the same as when we saw Delenn use it. B) there were three triluminaries. How many comlinks is Sinclair supposed to travel with? and C) We saw the inside of a comlink in "Objects in Motion" and there wasn't anything like it inside.

Jan

 

[Recoil]

I guess everybody has to believe what they want. I'll simply point out that A) we see the triluminary clearly when Sinclair begins the cocoon effect and the center piece of the triluminary is the same as when we saw Delenn use it. B) there were three triluminaries. How many comlinks is Sinclair supposed to travel with? and C) We saw the inside of a comlink in "Objects in Motion" and there wasn't anything like it inside.

Jan

Yea, but...

A) Not sure how this is rel event to the theory
B) Don't need three comlinks. For all we know an incredible small piece is all that's really needed to tie it to his DNA and that could be split between 100 comlinks for all we know.
C) Again, not sure how relevant that is, because its impossible to tell what part might have been used in its creation and how big that part might have been.

Another thing that keeps this as a valid theory (and apparently it is just a theory) is that there are more than a few facts in B5 that changed since Season 1 as the show evolved. Since when the show started it wasn't planned that Sinclair was going to be Valen, then its logical that when the Triluminary was introduced, these aspects were never made clear. There were a lot of Season 1 details that later seasons changed as the plot evolved (never MAJOR points, but somewhat minor ones)

You are right though...since it is a theory apparently and has never been stated (or proved one way or another) then people will believe whichever they think works or doesn't work. Seems like a good enough theory to me, and is a pretty cool one story wise.

 

[Jade Jaguar]

I don't see how there could be part of a comlink in a Triluminary. Surely modern Minbari would have recognized such a common piece of human tech, and been more than a bit scandalized by its presence there.

 

[Recoil]

Yea, but about when exactly would they have realized it was Human tech and been scandalized about it? Near the end or after the Earth Minbari War? Well, it wouldn't have been the only thing they would have been scandalized about. Still, I imagine with so many space faring races it would be tough to figure out what perhaps a small piece is and where its from. It may even just be a part of the metal itself which is supposed to be DNA bonded and not have any "circuitry" in it at all. How would anyone find out where a small spec of metal came from?

 

[KoshFan]

Yeah, plus, how many Minbari actually get a close look at a Triluminary? Just the Gray Council and a few flunkies. How many of them are experts on human technology? Heck, how many of them would actively disassemble one of their precious, deeply significant, and all-but-unique devices to get at the parts?

 

[crazyhorse]

I'm sure I remember the comlink coming into the series in season one and that in The Gathering they didn't have them so it would be a relatively new peice of technology.

I was also sure that the triluminary glowed for Delenn in ITB when used in a ceremony and they said it meant that she was a descendant of Valen (still carrying some of his DNA,was she not called a child of Valen?) although it didn't do this when she held it in season one.

I'll need to watch everything again I suppose as I've got so much of the series mixed up I don't know what is what anymore.

 

[darth_librarian]

Its a really cool theory, and ties neat a neat sci-fi idea (DNA bonded links) into a major plot element. I'm sure if you mentioned it to JMS and he said its not that case, he will wish it had been.