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Enterprise: "Azati Prime"
- Thread starter AntonyF
- Start date
M
Mike G
Guest
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Personally I thought that this episode kicked major ass. Best Enterprise yet? Maybe. Anyway these last few weeks have convinced me that this show dosn't deserve to be cancelled.
*sit ready for the Trek bashers*
Personally I thought that this episode kicked major ass. Best Enterprise yet? Maybe. Anyway these last few weeks have convinced me that this show dosn't deserve to be cancelled.
*sit ready for the Trek bashers*
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Gott agree with PT.
It was fucking kick ass... that was the first spine-tingle moment I ever got from Enterprise, at the end (spine-tingle moments are my way of judging good shows...)
But getting viewers back is a lot harder than keeping them.
Expect my article about Enterprise soon, maybe tomorrow.
Gott agree with PT.
It was fucking kick ass... that was the first spine-tingle moment I ever got from Enterprise, at the end (spine-tingle moments are my way of judging good shows...)
But getting viewers back is a lot harder than keeping them.
Expect my article about Enterprise soon, maybe tomorrow.
crazybillyo
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Just look away from the glowing red reset button...
Just look away from the glowing red reset button...
M
Mike G
Guest
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I belive we havn't herd anything offical about cancellation.
Again, I'm no expert, but what would UPN show if they didn't have Enterprise? It seems like they're only show that anyone watches.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I belive we havn't herd anything offical about cancellation.
Again, I'm no expert, but what would UPN show if they didn't have Enterprise? It seems like they're only show that anyone watches.
Shaal Mayan
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I would hate to see Enterprise cancelled IT FINALLY got interesting and I would like to see where the story line eventually goes .
I would hate to see Enterprise cancelled IT FINALLY got interesting and I would like to see where the story line eventually goes .
Strifeguard
Beyond the rim
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Sure, Enterprise looses out to Smallville, but let's be honest here, is anyone watching any *other* UPN shows?
I mean, no wonder Smallville does great in the ratings game, it's from the network that already has several successful shows. After all, if you were a "new" viewer, would you rather trust the people who brought you Angel and Charmed, or the wonderful peopl at UPN, who brought you, um... All of Us, and uh...(checks UPN webpage) Girlfriends, and um... the Mullets? (why isn't that cancelled yet?)
I just don't think that the failure of "Enterprise" has as much to do with the show's poor writing (though it is substandard) as it has to do with no one watching UPN.
This is what really gets me when people talk about the cancellation of Enterprise.
Sure, Enterprise looses out to Smallville, but let's be honest here, is anyone watching any *other* UPN shows?
I mean, no wonder Smallville does great in the ratings game, it's from the network that already has several successful shows. After all, if you were a "new" viewer, would you rather trust the people who brought you Angel and Charmed, or the wonderful peopl at UPN, who brought you, um... All of Us, and uh...(checks UPN webpage) Girlfriends, and um... the Mullets? (why isn't that cancelled yet?)
I just don't think that the failure of "Enterprise" has as much to do with the show's poor writing (though it is substandard) as it has to do with no one watching UPN.
DaRkEnEdStAr
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I dont mind Enterprise . I think its better than Voyager . I like it because it doesn`t allways go with the "Star Trek Line" what i mean is that a Star Trek episode has rules . I think Enterprise is hated by the Trekkers is because it goes where Star Trek never went . I would like JMS to do an episode though ...
I dont mind Enterprise . I think its better than Voyager . I like it because it doesn`t allways go with the "Star Trek Line" what i mean is that a Star Trek episode has rules . I think Enterprise is hated by the Trekkers is because it goes where Star Trek never went . I would like JMS to do an episode though ...
M
Mike G
Guest
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
Maybe, and some hate it because its not origial enough, and some because of this and that.
There are some good reasons not to like the show, but most of them disapear durring arc episodes...
Maybe, and some hate it because its not origial enough, and some because of this and that.
There are some good reasons not to like the show, but most of them disapear durring arc episodes...
DaRkEnEdStAr
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
what is original in the tv/film industry anymore ?
some of The characters are pretty lame though ...
what is original in the tv/film industry anymore ?
some of The characters are pretty lame though ...
Strifeguard
Beyond the rim
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
UPN's big gains were with "America's Top Model" and WWE. While WWE might have *some* crossover with Enterprise, the same cannot be said for their other programming.
It's one thing for UPN to draw in viewers to niche programming (and WWE fits the very definition of nice programming) but it's another thing entirely for them to bring in viewers who are willing to watch any of UPN's other shows (including Enterprise).
Yes, UPN is doing well, but it's almost entirely due to gains in "niche" markets.
UPN's big gains were with "America's Top Model" and WWE. While WWE might have *some* crossover with Enterprise, the same cannot be said for their other programming.
It's one thing for UPN to draw in viewers to niche programming (and WWE fits the very definition of nice programming) but it's another thing entirely for them to bring in viewers who are willing to watch any of UPN's other shows (including Enterprise).
colonyearth
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I tried, really I did...to watch Enterprise, for almost three years. I so wanted it to live up to its potential. I had to walk away and stay away, as have many Trek fans. Why? Because, to blindly support SF just because it is SF isn't supporting "good" SF.
Berman and Co. have systematically destroyed ST. There are a few good moments, yes, but those few IMO to not make up for the multitude of horrible ones, bad and boring writing, lame two-dimensional characters and complete lack of respect for the fans and the history of the universe and its cannon.
No, I made a pledge to myself that I would walk away, because I couldn't watch something I grew up loving so much...that inspired me so much as a creative soul, slowly die a painful death. After every episode, I found my blood pressure at a boil and my hatred of Berman growing (and I'm not a hateful person). If you want to change things in a set universe willy-nilly then leave that universe and create one of your own. But don't come into the ST universe and simply ingore or outright alter things whenever you feel like it without some legitimate and logical explanation, which is what happens over and over.
No...I made a promise...a vow, that I would turn my back on it, my way to telling Paramount that they've allowed a visionless man to run the show for far too long. When Berman and Co. are gone and someone with vision has replaced him and his croonies...I will gladly return in hopes that the spirit, excitement, vision and passion have returned as well.
Until then, no more Berman carrots for me...(that's what I call them...he throws out a carrot every now and then in a pathetic attempt to satiate the fans -- well I no longer fall for it).
Paramount will never make a move to change the status quo until the fans take a stand. I've made mine.
BTW, my insider source has heard that Paramount is very close to firing Berman and Co. They do realize that ST has floundered and is dieing a slow death. Reportedly they do want to do something about it, and do not want ST to die completely. One of the talks was to put Enterprise on hiatus, get rid of Berman, then get someone new to take the helm of ST and re-invision the show. Sadly, it may be too late for that.
One word was that Shatner was also called into Paramount for a meeting on working on a Trek film storyline. No word on what came of it. (If you've read Shatner's novels, then you know they're the best ST novels ever written and proof that Trek can still be fun, exciting and extremely well written and visionary, with the spirit and passion of that universe fully intact. They are, in short, what Trek could be and should be today.)
I have to stand on principle...B5, Stargate, Farscape...they all proved to me that great SF is still viable and that Trek just simply is a pale reflection of what it could be.
Nope. It literally hurts to watch it and see what it's become.
CE
I tried, really I did...to watch Enterprise, for almost three years. I so wanted it to live up to its potential. I had to walk away and stay away, as have many Trek fans. Why? Because, to blindly support SF just because it is SF isn't supporting "good" SF.
Berman and Co. have systematically destroyed ST. There are a few good moments, yes, but those few IMO to not make up for the multitude of horrible ones, bad and boring writing, lame two-dimensional characters and complete lack of respect for the fans and the history of the universe and its cannon.
No, I made a pledge to myself that I would walk away, because I couldn't watch something I grew up loving so much...that inspired me so much as a creative soul, slowly die a painful death. After every episode, I found my blood pressure at a boil and my hatred of Berman growing (and I'm not a hateful person). If you want to change things in a set universe willy-nilly then leave that universe and create one of your own. But don't come into the ST universe and simply ingore or outright alter things whenever you feel like it without some legitimate and logical explanation, which is what happens over and over.
No...I made a promise...a vow, that I would turn my back on it, my way to telling Paramount that they've allowed a visionless man to run the show for far too long. When Berman and Co. are gone and someone with vision has replaced him and his croonies...I will gladly return in hopes that the spirit, excitement, vision and passion have returned as well.
Until then, no more Berman carrots for me...(that's what I call them...he throws out a carrot every now and then in a pathetic attempt to satiate the fans -- well I no longer fall for it).
Paramount will never make a move to change the status quo until the fans take a stand. I've made mine.
BTW, my insider source has heard that Paramount is very close to firing Berman and Co. They do realize that ST has floundered and is dieing a slow death. Reportedly they do want to do something about it, and do not want ST to die completely. One of the talks was to put Enterprise on hiatus, get rid of Berman, then get someone new to take the helm of ST and re-invision the show. Sadly, it may be too late for that.
One word was that Shatner was also called into Paramount for a meeting on working on a Trek film storyline. No word on what came of it. (If you've read Shatner's novels, then you know they're the best ST novels ever written and proof that Trek can still be fun, exciting and extremely well written and visionary, with the spirit and passion of that universe fully intact. They are, in short, what Trek could be and should be today.)
I have to stand on principle...B5, Stargate, Farscape...they all proved to me that great SF is still viable and that Trek just simply is a pale reflection of what it could be.
Nope. It literally hurts to watch it and see what it's become.
CE
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I disagree with the anti-Berman and co. thoughts.
DS9 is still my favourite TV show ever... I'm sorry, but it's just plain good TV IMHO.
I loved TNG.
I loved Undiscovered Country, Generations, Insurrection and Nemesis.
Voyager was great to start off with, but declined.
But really... as Rick has been involved with the franchise for 17 years, and has run it for about 13 years, I'd like to know what exactly is good that is left that he hasn't done? The original series?
Star Trek hasn't been so great in recent years.. true. But then everything loses its steam.
You mention Stargate, that's a show I gave up on because it just got very very tired.
As to your insider source... he/she probably just read what's been on the news sites publically anyway about the reported Berman-ousting.
I disagree with the anti-Berman and co. thoughts.
DS9 is still my favourite TV show ever... I'm sorry, but it's just plain good TV IMHO.
I loved TNG.
I loved Undiscovered Country, Generations, Insurrection and Nemesis.
Voyager was great to start off with, but declined.
But really... as Rick has been involved with the franchise for 17 years, and has run it for about 13 years, I'd like to know what exactly is good that is left that he hasn't done? The original series?
Star Trek hasn't been so great in recent years.. true. But then everything loses its steam.
You mention Stargate, that's a show I gave up on because it just got very very tired.
As to your insider source... he/she probably just read what's been on the news sites publically anyway about the reported Berman-ousting.
colonyearth
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
You're in a crowd of few on the Berman thing. Main stream magazines have called for his ouster and I can trace the beginning of ST's decline to his taking over the reigns. Do some research on the man and you'll find he's, at the least, supported writers and producers (Braga) who have repeatedly insulted the fans. Berman himself has said that the fans are "stupid."
No his desire was apparently to piss off the fans and make new ones loyal to him. Well, it worked..sort of. Most of the fans have left and probably won't return until he's gone and Paramount does a marketing blitz to the effect that ST is under new management, but the "new fans" he literally said he wanted to replace old ones haven't appeared.
As for my insider...he works in the industry and has occasional access to information. I spoke with my connection today and what is being said is that if Enterprise is cancelled (which it's a real possibility that it will be) Berman is gone for good.
Also, that two new possible series concepts have been put forth (neither of which were Berman's and would not involve him) that Paramount is reportedly very interested in in order to hopefully revitalize the franchise.
To blame it on how long Trek has been going is ludicrous...it simply needs someone with vision and imagination and passion behind it. It has been sadly missing that since TNG. While I will give you that DS9 was IMO the third best of the Trek series...that third is a distant one to previous incarnations.
If you gave up on Stargate...your choice...too bad, you've missed some great moments and great character interplay. Stargate has that great ensemble casting and characters as a team and family that has been sorely missing from ST.
If you love Trek, I simply can't see why you're hanging on as Berman and Co. systematically ignore and destroy the universe's history, which was rich and full of ideas if someone were imaginative enough to actually see them.
Ah, if only they would put me in charge...the ideas I have.
Oh, well, dreams are what makes life worth living sometimes.
I loved the original cast ST films, although I will grant you that ST5 was the worst and needed help. However, as a filmmaker I can see what went wrong and know that it wasn't all Shatner's fault.
As for the TNG films, Generations was ok, but told the wrong story. First Contact was what I like to call premature ejaculation...meaning all of the good stuff happened in the first 10 minutes, after that it was what ST has become, talking, talking, talking, two dimensional characters and hum-drum...it didn't move me and in the end I simply didn't care. Insurrection was what I call, dead erection...it never got up and I fell asleep. Now Nemesis was IMO the best of the TNG films so far...too bad no one hardly saw it because they had already given up on Trek. Could it have been better? Yes, and I rank it as my fourth favorite ST film: 1st being ST2, then ST6, close behind in third is ST4 and fourth, though a distant fourth and close to ST3 IMO is Nemesis. A much better attempt...but still room to grow and imagine.
Oh, and I can also tell you that Bryan Singer has been approached by Paramount to direct the next ST film...but they are in no rush to make it. Given that fact that it was Paramount, not Berman, who approached him one can assume that it's because they're waiting until after Berman is gone, which was one criteria reportedly from some of the people involved and some others who've been approached.
No, face it, Bermans' days are numbered. One thing I can also say from my source is that Berman reportedly approached Lucasfilm in hopes of working there, but was flatly turned away.
No one is too fond of him, that much is clear. He has driven one of the largest worldwide fan bases in history away and left one of the biggest money making creations in history on the brink of extinction. Not a good thing to have on your resume.
Believe me or not, my source simply relays the current buzz and talk that he/she has been privy to and has seen "come across his/her desk" so to speak. As with anything in Hollywood things change fast and often times quickly, so who knows what will really happen...this is only what has reportedly been said in recent months. As for the two new ST series, those have literally "come across the desk" for consideration, so maybe.
Only time will tell.
CE
You're in a crowd of few on the Berman thing. Main stream magazines have called for his ouster and I can trace the beginning of ST's decline to his taking over the reigns. Do some research on the man and you'll find he's, at the least, supported writers and producers (Braga) who have repeatedly insulted the fans. Berman himself has said that the fans are "stupid."
No his desire was apparently to piss off the fans and make new ones loyal to him. Well, it worked..sort of. Most of the fans have left and probably won't return until he's gone and Paramount does a marketing blitz to the effect that ST is under new management, but the "new fans" he literally said he wanted to replace old ones haven't appeared.
As for my insider...he works in the industry and has occasional access to information. I spoke with my connection today and what is being said is that if Enterprise is cancelled (which it's a real possibility that it will be) Berman is gone for good.
Also, that two new possible series concepts have been put forth (neither of which were Berman's and would not involve him) that Paramount is reportedly very interested in in order to hopefully revitalize the franchise.
To blame it on how long Trek has been going is ludicrous...it simply needs someone with vision and imagination and passion behind it. It has been sadly missing that since TNG. While I will give you that DS9 was IMO the third best of the Trek series...that third is a distant one to previous incarnations.
If you gave up on Stargate...your choice...too bad, you've missed some great moments and great character interplay. Stargate has that great ensemble casting and characters as a team and family that has been sorely missing from ST.
If you love Trek, I simply can't see why you're hanging on as Berman and Co. systematically ignore and destroy the universe's history, which was rich and full of ideas if someone were imaginative enough to actually see them.
Ah, if only they would put me in charge...the ideas I have.
Oh, well, dreams are what makes life worth living sometimes.
I loved the original cast ST films, although I will grant you that ST5 was the worst and needed help. However, as a filmmaker I can see what went wrong and know that it wasn't all Shatner's fault.
As for the TNG films, Generations was ok, but told the wrong story. First Contact was what I like to call premature ejaculation...meaning all of the good stuff happened in the first 10 minutes, after that it was what ST has become, talking, talking, talking, two dimensional characters and hum-drum...it didn't move me and in the end I simply didn't care. Insurrection was what I call, dead erection...it never got up and I fell asleep. Now Nemesis was IMO the best of the TNG films so far...too bad no one hardly saw it because they had already given up on Trek. Could it have been better? Yes, and I rank it as my fourth favorite ST film: 1st being ST2, then ST6, close behind in third is ST4 and fourth, though a distant fourth and close to ST3 IMO is Nemesis. A much better attempt...but still room to grow and imagine.
Oh, and I can also tell you that Bryan Singer has been approached by Paramount to direct the next ST film...but they are in no rush to make it. Given that fact that it was Paramount, not Berman, who approached him one can assume that it's because they're waiting until after Berman is gone, which was one criteria reportedly from some of the people involved and some others who've been approached.
No, face it, Bermans' days are numbered. One thing I can also say from my source is that Berman reportedly approached Lucasfilm in hopes of working there, but was flatly turned away.
No one is too fond of him, that much is clear. He has driven one of the largest worldwide fan bases in history away and left one of the biggest money making creations in history on the brink of extinction. Not a good thing to have on your resume.
Believe me or not, my source simply relays the current buzz and talk that he/she has been privy to and has seen "come across his/her desk" so to speak. As with anything in Hollywood things change fast and often times quickly, so who knows what will really happen...this is only what has reportedly been said in recent months. As for the two new ST series, those have literally "come across the desk" for consideration, so maybe.
Only time will tell.
CE
M
Mike G
Guest
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I never understood this. Please give me a few examples of legitimate changes to Star Trek.
You can't be too hard on Berman and Braga. I agree, its been time for them to go for a long time, but I don't know if I would go as far as to say he has killed the entire series, or piss of fans on purpose.
Wholly Fuck that would be awesome!
I never understood this. Please give me a few examples of legitimate changes to Star Trek.
You can't be too hard on Berman and Braga. I agree, its been time for them to go for a long time, but I don't know if I would go as far as to say he has killed the entire series, or piss of fans on purpose.
Wholly Fuck that would be awesome!
A_M_Swallow
Regular
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
There does appear to be many people in the Entertainment Buisness who believe that they can ignore the core SF fans when making science fiction. If you want to make a weepy stick to the romantic film genra.
There does appear to be many people in the Entertainment Buisness who believe that they can ignore the core SF fans when making science fiction. If you want to make a weepy stick to the romantic film genra.
vacantlook
Super Moderator
Re: Enterprise: \"Azati Prime\"
I'm not too surprised to read this since Bryan had a cameo in Nemesis. But it is cool to know that the suits are actually considering getting him to do it.
I'm not too surprised to read this since Bryan had a cameo in Nemesis. But it is cool to know that the suits are actually considering getting him to do it.
