'Revenge of the Sith' reviews (Spoilers)

[GKarsEye]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

They just tried to take some elements of the original that worked and said "OK, lets do that same thing again, but a lot more of it"

Yeah- the wrong elements.

Princess Leia is one of the great characters of the original trilogy- a cool, tough chick gettng her hands dirty in a righteous rebellion and caught up in a romantic whirlwind with a bad-ass rogue with a heart of gold.

This trilogy had no cool chicks.

Everbody is so serious. All the Jedi are deep mystical annoying fucks, even Yoda. Only Obi Wan exhibited the slightest bit of personality.

Though I didn't feel the weight of Anakin's turn to the dark side as much as I could have (not blaming the pacing, which I agree with Pillowrock was fine), I must also point out that I never felt the emotional weight of Luke's struggle with the dark side. Ooh, he killed fake-Vader in a cave and it was like totally HIS face in the mask! Bleh.

 

[Recoil]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

But it's quite true, the worst thing about the new trilogy is the humans. I am growing strongly suspicious of the directing, hell, even Samuel L Jackson just seemed wooden to me .. and that really shouldn't be. McGregor was the only exception for me, he's the only human in the movie I could believe was having emotions.

Frankly, I have to believe that Lucas is mainly at fault for some of these issues regarding the "wooden" feel of so many characters. I can totally picture him telling McGreggor and Jackson "Look guys, you are supposed to play calm, controlled, warrior monks, who are patient and wise" and asking them to give that plain vanilla performance. I guess it IS sort of what you would expect from that sort of character...its just that we haven't seen that before to this degree. Still, I think it was a bit overdone and just felt "wrong"

 

[Chilli]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Yeah .. indeed. And it *can* be done better .. see Alec Guiness in A New Hope. Though I suspect that maybe he was giving his imput to the script too and was standing up to Lucas bit .. maybe noone in the new trilogy had the respect to do that, also just with Star Wars being SO big already and thus also the belief that Lucas has a clue about what he's doing .. whereas in the old trilogy, people with strong personalities like Harrison Ford, Carrie Fisher or Alec Guiness were involved from the beginning and had no reason to assume Lucas was some kind of god with a perfect plan for it all .. I really don't know. It's all speculation anyways .. I was wondering though. The mellowness of people like Samuel L Jackson (and Liam Neeson too in Episode one if I recall correctly) just made no sense to me.

 

[GKarsEye]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Jedi are supposed to be calm and emotionless. Even when they fight- the only emotion any of the Jedi show is determination and general "aggressiveness," not fear or anger because of course that's bad dark side mooju. Contrast that to Palpatine fighting and he does it with hate, anger, and even joy.

Maybe the film was doomed to suffer emotionally becuase it just had too many damn Jedi.



The more I think about the Palpatine creating Anakin theory, the more I'm inclined to go with my first instinct and reject it. Why create him and abandon him on some desert planet, allowing him to be raised by the enemy and then have to convert him? Most importantly, Palpatine lied about everything else. In that scene telling Anaking the story, he was just manipulating him, tempting him with exactly the two things that would get Anakin to follow him: a way to save his wife and power.

 

[Recoil]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I don't think the theory is that Palpatine created Anikin.

I think the theory is that Palpatine's Master created Anikin through the force, to eventually replace Palpatine, or just to see if he could, who knows. He was the one who created him. Maybe he was killed right after he "created" Anikin in his mother, and thus the information of who he was or what he was, was lost with the death of that Sith Master. It wasn't until ObiWan and QuiGon found him, studied him, and found out he was created by those Metachlorians that rumors about his origins surfaced --- which is when Sideous would have heard about him and gained an interest.

Its all conjecture, but its a cool theory if true. Perhaps Sideous's master did this to take advantage of the Jedi legend of the chosen one, in an eventual plan to overthrow them. It has roots of a very long and well thought out plan on his part if that was the case.

 

[Fas]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I think the force itself created Anakin, not any Jedi or Sith.... Anakin IS the chose one who "brings balance to the force", not Luke.

Bringing balance can't mean that there are equal Jedi and equal Sith, because in the end there are only Jedi, and that would mean that Anakin failed and so he is not the chosen one right?

I think imbalance means a disruption in "the force", in the form of wra and hatred. This disruption is the classic war between good and evil, JedivsSith.

Anakin, by killing all the unforgiving Jedi who would fight the Sith, joining the dark side, having a child who eventually renunciates violence against any Sith, killing Palpatine, and reuniting with the good side he had never left in the first place... fulfils the prophecy. Luke is the only Jedi left, one who doesn't believe in killing or war, and therefore the galaxy is in peace.

 

[GKarsEye]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Bringing balance can't mean that there are equal Jedi and equal Sith, because in the end there are only Jedi, and that would mean that Anakin failed and so he is not the chosen one right?

The prophecy doesn't say the balance he brings will be forever and ever. If the "balance" is between Jedi & Sith, then it lasts for about 18 years or so, a pretty good run for a prophecy.

 

[Bab5nutz]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Maybe the novelisation by Matthew Stover will explain. I had a quick look at it in a bookshop oneday, and it was a lot more detailed than the movie. I am now waiting for my reservation at the library to come through. Want to read it, I do - but at $59.95 NZ, buying it, I am not.

 

[Jendia]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Vader's "nooooo" pretty much killed it all for me.

 

[Jendia]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Joe--
I always thought it should never even have been brought up that they were humans. It doesn't make sense; there's no link to Earth, as in some shows/movies.
Then again, my brother used to give me hell whenever he would see a Centauri: "They look human." (To which I should have replied, they were different in...ahem... several ways. )
Maybe we should be glad Lucas didn't entirely redo all the humans in some CGI format, so they don't even look like humans, the horrors!! Maybe then the characters could be even more sterile/devoid of charisma than they were in the prequel trilogy. Yuck, he probably will do something like this.

 

[Recoil]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Vader's "nooooo" pretty much killed it all for me.

Vader's "Noooooooooooo" scene is quickly becoming the next:

"KHAAAAAAAANNNNNN!"

 

[Sinclair]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I loved the whole 'Nooooo!' It showed Vader as a man still capable of an unSith emotion: sadness. He has lost someone very dear to him, and other than sustaining those life threatening injuries on Mustafar, his life is forever changed. All he feels now is hatred. Along with losing the only one he truly loved, his body is now completely different and he has sworn his allegiance to Sidious. He knows there's no backing out of his current situation and the only word he can muster is 'Noooo'. At that point, Anakin is officially Darth Vader. He has lost all connection to his old life...until he learns of his son, and that's the only thing that can bring him back.

I wept like a little girl during this scene.

 

[vacantlook]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I think everything Anakin did in RotS will have a huge impact on me the next time I watch RotJ and watch the scene in the hallway between Vader and Luke before Vader takes Luke to see the Emperor. Vader's always kinda seemed pensive and sad in that scene; now we have a greater idea as to what he's thinking about.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I was just rewatching some of the first seaosn of B5 and was struck by the scenes between Catherine Sakai and Sinclair - especially the first dinner scene in the Zocalo. "How's your aunt?" "How's your brother?" You can argue that Catherine's lines about their partings and joinings are too self-conciously articulate (although her interest in poetry makes this quite plausible for the character) but you can't deny that the relationship feels right. I buy that these two have been on and off again for years, because I've been in relationships like that. The slow build-up of the Sheridan-Delenn relationship, Garibadi's shift from someone wary of Sheridan to one of his best friends, they all work, too. Sheridan and Delenn's final parting at dawn on Minbar is another example of a scene where I believe the characters have been together for 20 years and where the lines were perfectly in character, the ritual call and response quality of it a natural side effect of 20 years living on Minbar. There isn't a single second in the Anakin Padme relationship (and damned few in the Anakin-Obi Wan relationship) that strike me as this genuine.

Since so many people are talking about how much better Hayden Christiansen is in this film than in the last, I'm not in any hurry to see Episode 2. There was a great FARK headline that link to a story about Christiansen possibly retiring from showbiz. "Hayden Christiansen says he might quit acting. You mean what he's been doing up until now has been acting?"

Regards,

Joe

 

[A_Ranger]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Jedi are supposed to be calm and emotionless. Even when they fight- the only emotion any of the Jedi show is determination and general "aggressiveness," not fear or anger because of course that's bad dark side mooju. Contrast that to Palpatine fighting and he does it with hate, anger, and even joy.

Maybe the film was doomed to suffer emotionally becuase it just had too many damn Jedi.

I disagree. The Jedi are basically samurais (mainly anyway, Lucas has created a wierd half assed mix that I dont think he really put too much thought into). And samurais are calm and unemotional...on the surface. They're human, and beneath the calm surface boils deep emotion. Just watch Seven Samurai or The Last Sumurai for calm samurai acting that isn't wooden or unemotional. If you ask me, Lucas is just a terrible director. He himself has said "I dont' talk to the actors much", which is rediculosu considering that is a director's job.

 

[Jade Jaguar]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

If Anakin's birth did happen at the hands of a Sith (meaning if it wasn't just some elaborate lie Sidious was telling Anakin), then I have serious doubts that it was Sidious that did the creation. He tells Anakin about how Plagueis could create life through manipulation of midi-chlorians and could extend life, and he then says Plagueis taught his apprentice everything he knew. However!, in a later scene Sidious tells Anakin that if Anakin joins him that together they can discover the powers to create immortality.

All that makes me think that Plagueis created Anakin, Sidious found out about it and realized that, in typical Sith fashion, Plagueis intended on replacing Sidious with Anakin. So, Sidious acted first, killing his master, ascending to position of senior Sith, and decided to eventually take on Anakin as his own apprentice. Sidious says that all Sith want more power. I think in this statement he's sutbly saying how he wanted more power but didn't get taught everything he wanted from Plagueis (thus spawning the statement later to Anakin that together they could discover the power to save Padmé). He doesn't know everything Plagueis knew, but he's hoping that having Anakin around long enough will help him to learn by proxy, if you will.

I agree 100%. This is exactly what they were saying, and were pretty direct about it, giving us obvious pieces to put together.

 

[Jonny_Fever]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I personally would have liked to have seen more Vader post-accident in his mask and cape. To me it would have been interesting to see Obi Wan's reaction at meeting his pupil again.

 

[Sinclair]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

To me it would have been interesting to see Obi Wan's reaction at meeting his pupil again.

Try watching Episode IV, A New Hope.

I personally would have liked to have seen more Vader post-accident in his mask and cape.

Watch Episodes IV-VI.

 

[Fas]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

Bringing balance can't mean that there are equal Jedi and equal Sith, because in the end there are only Jedi, and that would mean that Anakin failed and so he is not the chosen one right?

The prophecy doesn't say the balance he brings will be forever and ever. If the "balance" is between Jedi & Sith, then it lasts for about 18 years or so, a pretty good run for a prophecy.

That would be a terrible prophecy. He is supposed to be some kind of messiah and he brings 18 years of a dictatorship? Then he wouldn't be the hero Lucas makes him up to be.

 

[GKarsEye]

Re: \'Revenge of the Sith\' reviews (Spoilers)

I agree 100%. This is exactly what they were saying, and were pretty direct about it, giving us obvious pieces to put together.

It is not obvious. Sorry, I don't buy it. We're all assuming that Plagius was Sidius' master, which is a stretch in the first place.

Then he wouldn't be the hero Lucas makes him up to be.

Vader a hero? Are we watching the same movies?