Jan
Regular
Your scientists?
The exact line was:
If you can show me a Thesaurus where 'hint' and 'concluded' mean the same, I'll concede the point. Otherwise I think you're angry over something you misheard.
Jan
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B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)
- Thread starter Recoil
- Start date
The exact line was:
Jan
Well, I don't own the scientists, I just really appreciate and respect what they do and how they do it. They do so much for all of us and this planet and I just take offense when people speak ill about them or their work or ideas, like alot of fanatically religious idiots like our President. But I'm not saying that's what is going on in the movie, that's just how I regard scientists or physicists or other "ists".
Thanks for finding that for me cause I was not trying to rewatch any scene in the movie for some time. Sorry, I guess I was a little off. Ok, so exactly how do you interpret this excerpt? From this, it looks like the Father was stating that science will never be able to disprove God and that scientific studies have "pointed" to Intelligence (which I have yet to hear about one). That's how I interpret it. I'm not saying I'm right but that's what I'm seeing.
Here are the definitions and synonyms for "hint" as requested. Sure it doesn't match "conclude" but "imply" and "suggest" come pretty darn close.
NOUN: 1. A subtle pointing out: clue, cue, intimation, suggestion. 2. A subtle quality underlying or felt to underlie a situation, action, or person: implication, inkling, suspicion, undercurrent, undertone. 3. A slight amount or indication: breath, dash, ghost, hair, intimation, semblance, shade, shadow, streak, suggestion, suspicion, taste, tinge, touch, trace, whiff, whisper.
VERB: 1. To convey an idea by indirect, subtle means: imply, insinuate, intimate, suggest. Idioms: drop a hint. 2. To try to obtain something, usually by subtleness and cunning: angle, fish.
Ok, I off to literally go watch "In the begining" in a few minutes with my girlfriend. That's my favorite B5 movie - it had it all. She got me the movie collection on DVD for our 3 year anniversary and I have'nt watched a one yet. Can't wait! That should clense my B5 palette.
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Jan
Regular
Remember, the quote I looked up was Father Cassidy's response to Lochley saying that there are plenty of scientists who believe in God.
How do I interpret it? I simply see a character who's devoted to his work and his calling but who feels increasingly, not useless but perhaps underutilised. I see somebody being painfully honest about what he thinks and feels, who's a little discouraged at the moment but who still strongly believes in his calling and his God.
I don't interpret it to mean that JMS was trying to proselytize or convince us of anything. All I see is two people having a conversation about their beliefs. I certainly don't see it as any kind of Christian tale, rather as a morality tale just as the second segment (I'm sorry, I refuse to call them 'Over Here' and 'Over There') is.
Keeping in mind, of course, that B5 is set two and a half centuries in our future, it might interest you to do a search on the terms 'quantum particles intelligence'. How much those articles have to do with real science, I don't know-I don't speak physics. But the fact that there were 143,000 hits containing those three terms seems to indicate that the subject might just be being studied, or at least discussed, the way that Father Cassidy spoke of.
If there was anything that bugged me at all about the whole DVD it was that Earth suddenly had so much importance.
Jan
AnlaShokGrey
Regular
Been gone for awhile, but really enjoying the discussion here. Couple of things:
1) A couple of pages back, Legend suggested that if Earth was destroyed with all of these "demons" (or whatever they were) on it, then all evil would be gone from the universe. I beg to differ. Even if you did assume a fully Christian slant on things, there is The Devil (capital "T" capital "D"), also known as "Satan," (also sometimes "Lucifer," the light-bringer and fallen angel) which is a Christian construct meant to embody all of the evil in the world. This is distinct from generic demons (lower case "d"), which are mischief-making minions, lesser forms. This demon called himself Asmodeus, which means he believes he is Asmodai, a minor demon probably derived from Persian mythology, but in no way the sole embodiment of worldly evil. And even if Asmodai = Satan, and even if you believe that all evil actions by humans proceed from demonic intervention, who says that other worlds don't have some kind of evil beings there?
2) Again, Legend (sorry, I'm not trying to pick on you, yours were just the interesting comments that caught my attention!) said more recently, "And looking at his father who was clinically insane, chances are there was little hope for this kid." Holy crap! "Insanity" (which isn't a clinical term, anyway) isn't hereditary! Let's not be hasty with running out and killing all people whose parents are loopy! Most of us would be dead, if we did that!
Amy
1) A couple of pages back, Legend suggested that if Earth was destroyed with all of these "demons" (or whatever they were) on it, then all evil would be gone from the universe. I beg to differ. Even if you did assume a fully Christian slant on things, there is The Devil (capital "T" capital "D"), also known as "Satan," (also sometimes "Lucifer," the light-bringer and fallen angel) which is a Christian construct meant to embody all of the evil in the world. This is distinct from generic demons (lower case "d"), which are mischief-making minions, lesser forms. This demon called himself Asmodeus, which means he believes he is Asmodai, a minor demon probably derived from Persian mythology, but in no way the sole embodiment of worldly evil. And even if Asmodai = Satan, and even if you believe that all evil actions by humans proceed from demonic intervention, who says that other worlds don't have some kind of evil beings there?
2) Again, Legend (sorry, I'm not trying to pick on you, yours were just the interesting comments that caught my attention!) said more recently, "And looking at his father who was clinically insane, chances are there was little hope for this kid." Holy crap! "Insanity" (which isn't a clinical term, anyway) isn't hereditary! Let's not be hasty with running out and killing all people whose parents are loopy! Most of us would be dead, if we did that!
Amy
vacantlook
Super Moderator
Such moral absolutism found in terms like "truly evil" sound like something that belongs in a religious story, and I thought you had a problem with heavy religious tones in stories.
Of course, Galen already beat you to it in the story itself.
Of course, the key difference in the situation you cite from ACTA is that Sheridan risked the lives of members of the military. Here in TLT we're talking about Sheridan contemplating assassinating someone. That's a vastly different moral quandary than calling on the military to risk their lives in service to defend others.
Of course, that celebration was not what the story was about. Plus, such a celebration scene would cost more money than they had available.
TLT is not the same type of story as ITB. TLT is not a movie, despite the stupid label of "an original movie" slapped on the cover by WB. "Voices In The Darkness" is written and designed to the first volume in a hopefully multiple volume direct-to-DVD anthology series. jms told us this was an anthology series, provided WB gives the ok to make more. It's to be smaller, more intimate stories centered around a particular character. In this volume, we got one centered around Lockley and one around Sheridan. There was going to be one around Garibaldi, but there just wasn't enough money in the budget to do the surface of Mars any justice, so that was pushed back to the tentative volume two. The story of TLT isn't supposed to be on the level of ITB. Why do you think it should have been when we were told well in advance that it was an anthology series and what that specifically was going to be like?
vacantlook
Super Moderator
And we've missed you.
He said Asmodeus? And here I was telling myself he had said Ozymandias with a heavy accent. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
We even had the possessing being state early on that he wasn't The Big Evil but just servant or minion or other such word.
A_Ranger
Regular
Just watched it, even though I bought it yesterday. I was not eagerly awaiting this DVD. Though I finished another run of B5 in December, I hadn't thought about B5 or even checked B5 sites since then until a month ago, when I barely discovered this thing was happening.
I enjoyed it. I do think the first segment was the weaker of the two, but I still found it interesting. Like many others have already spoken, the dialogue needed some trimming, less emphasis on words and more on visuals, etc. Mainly, and this is coming from a USC Graduate Film student, I think JMS shouldn't be directing. His style is not very visually appealing. It's rather stale and flat. JMS knows how to tell a story, but not necessarily how to film one. It also seemed obvious that he doesn't know how to work with actors. The performances of the B5 vets were good because they know their characters and just had to step back into their shoes. But the secondary/new characters performances were hit or miss, and some of JMS's famous dialogue fell flat in their mouths. I hope, if future Tales are made, that he enlists other directors. Perhaps even tap some of the good B5 vets, like Mike Vejar, who can take JMS's excellent writing and make it visually appealing, as well as properly direct secondary/new actors. Well, that's my opinion anyway.
This could have been better, but I still enjoyed it and look forward to future tales. The memorials were also very nice and touching.
I enjoyed it. I do think the first segment was the weaker of the two, but I still found it interesting. Like many others have already spoken, the dialogue needed some trimming, less emphasis on words and more on visuals, etc. Mainly, and this is coming from a USC Graduate Film student, I think JMS shouldn't be directing. His style is not very visually appealing. It's rather stale and flat. JMS knows how to tell a story, but not necessarily how to film one. It also seemed obvious that he doesn't know how to work with actors. The performances of the B5 vets were good because they know their characters and just had to step back into their shoes. But the secondary/new characters performances were hit or miss, and some of JMS's famous dialogue fell flat in their mouths. I hope, if future Tales are made, that he enlists other directors. Perhaps even tap some of the good B5 vets, like Mike Vejar, who can take JMS's excellent writing and make it visually appealing, as well as properly direct secondary/new actors. Well, that's my opinion anyway.
This could have been better, but I still enjoyed it and look forward to future tales. The memorials were also very nice and touching.
vacantlook
Super Moderator
A_Ranger said:
Well then. I didn't come away from watching it thinking that at all. I was frequently visually entertained with camera movement and framing. I even exclaimed out loud while watching for the first time about the symmetry of the camera tilting over on its side on Lochley and Sheridan when they were respectively in the bed. Other things like the harsh downward shot over Galen while he swivvled in the chair, the framing of Vintari's eyes through the mesh grating on Sheridan's ship, etc all gave me little ooos and aahs.
Any particular examples you can cite? I really liked all of the guest cast and characters they played, so it would be interesting to see any specifics of what you thought fell flat.
I did want to add a little bit about the continuity between the Centauri trilogy and Voices in the Dark. On the DVD we are told by Vintari that he is third in line to the throne behind Vir because the Centarum voted him second in line in other words public knowledge, but in "Out of the Darkness" the picture is somewhat different because Londo dies then Vir talks with Renegar and Gwynn about power playing his way to being emperor. Of course, in the Vir also talks about being of high birth and having a claim to the throne, so it could just be a matter of the Centarum following through. "Voices" only gives us small glimpses into what's going on in the universe, so it's very hard to be dogmatic.
jms did say when the Del Ray books came out that he won't be bound to everything the authors wrote in the books. Maybe this is just the latest instance of his authority.
jms did say when the Del Ray books came out that he won't be bound to everything the authors wrote in the books. Maybe this is just the latest instance of his authority.
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Pakmaraatemycat
Member
Hello everyone. I've been a B5 fan since it first aired and not so long back got the boxed set and re-watched it in it's entirety. I had forgotten how good it was! I'm now back up to the Earth civil war, having got my Dad hooked
Anyway, I've now seen TLT1 a couple of times and so thought I would add my comments. I hope nobody minds?
I wasn't that keen on segment one the first time I saw it but watching it again I am really impressed. It is a superb sci-fi short story, although it would possibly be better suited to being a one off, set in an unknown future universe, but I can completely see why JMS wanted to tell this story. By being part of that continuum it does open some fascinating theological back story possibilities though. More on that later...
I think the reason a number of people have objected to the religious overtones is largely due to the lack of a sceptic character. In the series proper this role would have fallen neatly into the lap of either Garibaldi or Franklin but here JMS has done something different. He has assumed that most of the audience are already well aware of the B5 universe and so has set it up so that YOU, the viewer, ARE the sceptic. It leaves us, the audience, asking the questions we know Stephen or Michael would have asked if they were there. I think this is a very nice touch.
Whilst several other possibilities are open, including Burke having been telling the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, by far the simplest explanation is that Asmodeus is something left over from millennia of Vorlon or Shadow tinkering. I've spent some time considering whether the (Catholic as it became) church could be considered a force of order or of chaos and have come to the conclusion that it could be either, although neither very successfully. The way the church held Europe in the Dark Ages for nigh on 1,000 years by persecuting anyone with a new idea or innovation, whilst the Islamic world leapt ahead in leaps and bounds does seem contrary to both their stated objectives of helping the younger races advance.
Islam, on the other hand, would seem to be (in B5 context at least) a distinctly Vorlon religion. The Qu'ran was dictated to the Prophet Mohamed by an angel (Vorlon?). During the time of the Caliphate, the Muslim world made amazing breakthroughs in science, not least in mathematics and medicine. It was also, in context of it's times, a remarkably ordered society.
Of course, the Qu'ran takes it's roots with Abraham and continues through Moses and numerous other prophets up to Jesus and eventually Mohamed. This would suggest that they were all also Vorlon inspired. It could therefore be argued that Europe's Dark Ages were caused by Shadows (or their agents) perverting one of the strands of Vorlon Abrahamic teaching. The Great Schism and the Reformation as a direct result of Shadow interference? It's a tempting idea!
(The Great Schism in particular, would have been in the last couple of centuries before Valen's Shadow war.)
Certainly, during Lockley's final confrontation with Burke, whilst he is on tranqs, we hear a noise in the background that is far from dissimilar to what we heard when Morden was talking to his Shadow consorts.
It's always possible I am 100% wrong about this and JMS's mind was working in a completely different way. In either case, I sincerely hope that this is just a taster of something he intends to expand on later in the anthology.
I'm left with two unanswered questions from this segment:
Why was Burke tranquillised before the final showdown with Lockley? Who's idea was it and what purpose did they believe it would serve?
Lockley's final speech: "Every few days a new star liner arrives...". This seems to be a much lower volume of traffic than when Ivanova was in charge of CNC. The first sign of the decline in B5's usage?
This post is already several times longer than I'd expected for covering both segments so I think I'll hit submit now and start a new post for the Sheridan segment.
Hello again to you all,
Pak.
Anyway, I've now seen TLT1 a couple of times and so thought I would add my comments. I hope nobody minds?
I wasn't that keen on segment one the first time I saw it but watching it again I am really impressed. It is a superb sci-fi short story, although it would possibly be better suited to being a one off, set in an unknown future universe, but I can completely see why JMS wanted to tell this story. By being part of that continuum it does open some fascinating theological back story possibilities though. More on that later...
I think the reason a number of people have objected to the religious overtones is largely due to the lack of a sceptic character. In the series proper this role would have fallen neatly into the lap of either Garibaldi or Franklin but here JMS has done something different. He has assumed that most of the audience are already well aware of the B5 universe and so has set it up so that YOU, the viewer, ARE the sceptic. It leaves us, the audience, asking the questions we know Stephen or Michael would have asked if they were there. I think this is a very nice touch.
Whilst several other possibilities are open, including Burke having been telling the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, by far the simplest explanation is that Asmodeus is something left over from millennia of Vorlon or Shadow tinkering. I've spent some time considering whether the (Catholic as it became) church could be considered a force of order or of chaos and have come to the conclusion that it could be either, although neither very successfully. The way the church held Europe in the Dark Ages for nigh on 1,000 years by persecuting anyone with a new idea or innovation, whilst the Islamic world leapt ahead in leaps and bounds does seem contrary to both their stated objectives of helping the younger races advance.
Islam, on the other hand, would seem to be (in B5 context at least) a distinctly Vorlon religion. The Qu'ran was dictated to the Prophet Mohamed by an angel (Vorlon?). During the time of the Caliphate, the Muslim world made amazing breakthroughs in science, not least in mathematics and medicine. It was also, in context of it's times, a remarkably ordered society.
Of course, the Qu'ran takes it's roots with Abraham and continues through Moses and numerous other prophets up to Jesus and eventually Mohamed. This would suggest that they were all also Vorlon inspired. It could therefore be argued that Europe's Dark Ages were caused by Shadows (or their agents) perverting one of the strands of Vorlon Abrahamic teaching. The Great Schism and the Reformation as a direct result of Shadow interference? It's a tempting idea!
(The Great Schism in particular, would have been in the last couple of centuries before Valen's Shadow war.)
Certainly, during Lockley's final confrontation with Burke, whilst he is on tranqs, we hear a noise in the background that is far from dissimilar to what we heard when Morden was talking to his Shadow consorts.
It's always possible I am 100% wrong about this and JMS's mind was working in a completely different way. In either case, I sincerely hope that this is just a taster of something he intends to expand on later in the anthology.
I'm left with two unanswered questions from this segment:
Why was Burke tranquillised before the final showdown with Lockley? Who's idea was it and what purpose did they believe it would serve?
Lockley's final speech: "Every few days a new star liner arrives...". This seems to be a much lower volume of traffic than when Ivanova was in charge of CNC. The first sign of the decline in B5's usage?
This post is already several times longer than I'd expected for covering both segments so I think I'll hit submit now and start a new post for the Sheridan segment.
Hello again to you all,
Pak.
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Ranger1
Regular
welcome to the board man. your ideas blew my mind.
i have a few issues with TLT now that i think about it.
1) at the start when the station is demolished, i find myself preferring the original demolition where the station turns inside out. not really an issue but more a preference.
2) there isn't a second one, i forgot they found out delenn was up the spout during S5, guess that is what happens when you are willing to wipe an entire season from your memory just to forget byron.
i have a few issues with TLT now that i think about it.
1) at the start when the station is demolished, i find myself preferring the original demolition where the station turns inside out. not really an issue but more a preference.
2) there isn't a second one, i forgot they found out delenn was up the spout during S5, guess that is what happens when you are willing to wipe an entire season from your memory just to forget byron.
Pakmaraatemycat
Member
Right, onto the second segment.
This is far and away a much better piece of out and out entertainment than the first. However, it was less intellectually stimulating yet somehow opening far more questions about the galaxy our heroes live in.
The first point is, that whilst it was a mildly amusing joke, the journalist's camera was completely impractical for it's purpose. When conducting an interview though you generally want to see the faces of both the interviewee and the interviewer. It would have been almost impossible for her to keep twisting her chest to keep his face in frame as he paced and utterly impossible ever to get a shot of her. It was an obvious joke though and she had nice legs, so what are you going to do?
I was very pleased to see Galen's return. He was probably my favourite character in Crusade and I think Peter Woodward was an inspired piece of casting. I know from reading this board that there are many who disagree with me but that's my opinion. I thought his "City that never weeps" line was an absolute diamond. Although, it's not revealed until the end, the way he manipulates Sheridan with reverse psychology is not only poetic justice for Sheridan's behaviour in Rumours, Bargains and Lies, it's distinctly Machiavellian! His description of Sheridan as a nexus is reminiscent of Justin's speech on Z'ha'dum. Would the killing of Hitler have stopped say Eichman or Himler rising to such power and wielding it in a similar way? If the Great Khan had been stopped as a child, might not Jebei Noyan or A N Other have untied the Mongol tribes and created a similarly great empire? From what we know about how the B5 universe works, quite possibly yes. (In real life too; both the Germans and the tribes of the steppes were longing for strong leadership at those points in their histories...)
I do think the way Q-Space was introduced a little weird. The journo had never heard of it. This seems strange for two reasons: For such a high ranking journalist
to have no knowledge of it (she must have been high ranking to have got one on one time with the president) to have not have heard of it there must have been no great fanfair or press launch for it, which you would expect for a tech shortly to be rolled out to all the Alliance worlds. Secondly, if the reason for not having such a launch was that it was being kept as a military secret, allowing ANY journo to even get a sniff of it would be massively stupid. Of course, this doesn't rule out the possibility that she's incredibly ignorant and just shagged her way into the position. This may be massively naive but I would like to think that by the 23rd centaury even journalism may have discovered some sort of integrity and meritocracy.
Vintari's hair was a bit odd as well. I know his father set a brief trend for wearing one's hair shorter than one's station but thought that had died out with Cartagia (sp?) himself? Or perhaps it was an echo of Octavian trying to emulate Caesar?
I also think I may have spotted the first on-screen examples of transsexual Minbari. At least twice we get shots of a seemingly female Minbari with a distinctly male bone crest. The first when Vintari first arrives aboard the Valen class cruiser and the second, in the same (or at least a very similar looking) corridor, just after Sheridan offers him the chance to pilot a Starfury.
All this leaves me with two unanswered questions:
If Vir is second in line to the thrown, who is Heir Apparent?
(This is the big one) What the hell has happened to the Minbari? Galen states that only Earth has the ability to stop the Centari under Vintari's leadership. This must mean that both Earth and Centari Prime have leap-frogged Minbar in both tech and the means to deploy it. Now given the unknown Shadow tech that the Drakh may well have taken with them to Centari Prime, it is not unreasonable to suspect that Centari tech has moved on greatly in the last ten years but Earth? Evan given the ISA's policy of sharing tech between worlds, Earth could have, at best, closed the gap to where it is close but to have completely outstripped Minbar in such a short time seems hugely unlikely unless some great tragedy had befallen our boney-headed friends. I guess the attack on Earth in ACtA may just have been a feint in the opening of the Drakh War and that the main assault was on Minbar? Or perhaps some natural disaster they are still recovering from but neither of these seem consistent with the ISA (and therefore the Rangers) still being based there...
Besides, when did Earth stop Centari Prime in the past? There were barely any (if any at all) Earth ships involved in the 2262 fall of Centari Prime. Perhaps Galen spoke of events not yet known to us, the viewing public?
Right, you may be noticing I haven't mentioned anything other than plot points up to now. This is because having grown up on a diet of Blake's 7 and Dr. Who, the FX and even the acting are of far less import to me than a good story well told. With Voices in the Dark, JMS has given us two good stories. I am therefore happy. Even though I now know that TLT will never give me exactly what I was really hoping for, I.E. the definitive stories of both the Drakh and Teep wars. The anthology structure will never be able to allow stories of such scope although we may get glimpses of either or both. What we will get though, is a collection of well thought out stories, about characters we care about, in a universe we care about, where every answer leads to new questions.
Thank you JMS. This certainly wasn't your best work to date but I thoroughly enjoyed it and am very much hoping that this sells well enough that TLT2 can go into production quick-smart! Keep them coming. They make me happy
This is far and away a much better piece of out and out entertainment than the first. However, it was less intellectually stimulating yet somehow opening far more questions about the galaxy our heroes live in.
The first point is, that whilst it was a mildly amusing joke, the journalist's camera was completely impractical for it's purpose. When conducting an interview though you generally want to see the faces of both the interviewee and the interviewer. It would have been almost impossible for her to keep twisting her chest to keep his face in frame as he paced and utterly impossible ever to get a shot of her. It was an obvious joke though and she had nice legs, so what are you going to do?
I was very pleased to see Galen's return. He was probably my favourite character in Crusade and I think Peter Woodward was an inspired piece of casting. I know from reading this board that there are many who disagree with me but that's my opinion. I thought his "City that never weeps" line was an absolute diamond. Although, it's not revealed until the end, the way he manipulates Sheridan with reverse psychology is not only poetic justice for Sheridan's behaviour in Rumours, Bargains and Lies, it's distinctly Machiavellian! His description of Sheridan as a nexus is reminiscent of Justin's speech on Z'ha'dum. Would the killing of Hitler have stopped say Eichman or Himler rising to such power and wielding it in a similar way? If the Great Khan had been stopped as a child, might not Jebei Noyan or A N Other have untied the Mongol tribes and created a similarly great empire? From what we know about how the B5 universe works, quite possibly yes. (In real life too; both the Germans and the tribes of the steppes were longing for strong leadership at those points in their histories...)
I do think the way Q-Space was introduced a little weird. The journo had never heard of it. This seems strange for two reasons: For such a high ranking journalist
to have no knowledge of it (she must have been high ranking to have got one on one time with the president) to have not have heard of it there must have been no great fanfair or press launch for it, which you would expect for a tech shortly to be rolled out to all the Alliance worlds. Secondly, if the reason for not having such a launch was that it was being kept as a military secret, allowing ANY journo to even get a sniff of it would be massively stupid. Of course, this doesn't rule out the possibility that she's incredibly ignorant and just shagged her way into the position. This may be massively naive but I would like to think that by the 23rd centaury even journalism may have discovered some sort of integrity and meritocracy.
Vintari's hair was a bit odd as well. I know his father set a brief trend for wearing one's hair shorter than one's station but thought that had died out with Cartagia (sp?) himself? Or perhaps it was an echo of Octavian trying to emulate Caesar?
I also think I may have spotted the first on-screen examples of transsexual Minbari. At least twice we get shots of a seemingly female Minbari with a distinctly male bone crest. The first when Vintari first arrives aboard the Valen class cruiser and the second, in the same (or at least a very similar looking) corridor, just after Sheridan offers him the chance to pilot a Starfury.
All this leaves me with two unanswered questions:
If Vir is second in line to the thrown, who is Heir Apparent?
(This is the big one) What the hell has happened to the Minbari? Galen states that only Earth has the ability to stop the Centari under Vintari's leadership. This must mean that both Earth and Centari Prime have leap-frogged Minbar in both tech and the means to deploy it. Now given the unknown Shadow tech that the Drakh may well have taken with them to Centari Prime, it is not unreasonable to suspect that Centari tech has moved on greatly in the last ten years but Earth? Evan given the ISA's policy of sharing tech between worlds, Earth could have, at best, closed the gap to where it is close but to have completely outstripped Minbar in such a short time seems hugely unlikely unless some great tragedy had befallen our boney-headed friends. I guess the attack on Earth in ACtA may just have been a feint in the opening of the Drakh War and that the main assault was on Minbar? Or perhaps some natural disaster they are still recovering from but neither of these seem consistent with the ISA (and therefore the Rangers) still being based there...
Besides, when did Earth stop Centari Prime in the past? There were barely any (if any at all) Earth ships involved in the 2262 fall of Centari Prime. Perhaps Galen spoke of events not yet known to us, the viewing public?
Right, you may be noticing I haven't mentioned anything other than plot points up to now. This is because having grown up on a diet of Blake's 7 and Dr. Who, the FX and even the acting are of far less import to me than a good story well told. With Voices in the Dark, JMS has given us two good stories. I am therefore happy. Even though I now know that TLT will never give me exactly what I was really hoping for, I.E. the definitive stories of both the Drakh and Teep wars. The anthology structure will never be able to allow stories of such scope although we may get glimpses of either or both. What we will get though, is a collection of well thought out stories, about characters we care about, in a universe we care about, where every answer leads to new questions.
Thank you JMS. This certainly wasn't your best work to date but I thoroughly enjoyed it and am very much hoping that this sells well enough that TLT2 can go into production quick-smart! Keep them coming. They make me happy
vacantlook
Super Moderator
They tranqed him because they were going to transport Simon Burke back to Earth to let Father Cassidy exorcise him there to keep the demon on Earth instead of releasing him back while in space as the demon wanted.
hypatia
Regular
Up the spout? What had Delenn totally ruined in Season 5?
Did you mean "up the Duff", by any chance? Interesting word.
"Duff is the layer of decomposing organic materials that resides between the mineral soil and the litter layer of freshly fallen twigs, needles, and leaves."
Wow, do pregnant women really offend some men so much? Someone had better tip off Alluveal that she just gave birth to a layer of decomposing organic materials that reside between mineral soil and the layer of freshly fallen twigs, needles, and leaves? Kind of like starting to make compost?
Hmm.
AnlaShokGrey
Regular
"Up the spout" and "up the duff" are both British slang for "pregnant," according to my favorite British slang site: http://www.peevish.co.uk/slang/
Amy
Amy
KoshN
Super Moderator
No, that would have been mentioned in the Legions of Fire (Centauri) trilogy of novels. What was mentioned was that the plague was intended to be used on Minbar. See, for reasons revealed in that trilogy, the Drakh only had ONE Shadow Planetkiller. After the planetkiller was destroyed at Earth, the plague that would have been released on Minbar, was pressed into service on Earth.
Earth is a major part of the IA, which Londo/keeper blames for the Centauri Empire's problems (including the reparations). Remember Londo's speech to the people immediately after he became emperor? Sure, Earth didn't have any ships in the assault of Centauri Prime, but Londo/keeper holds Sheridan responsible for not preventing the attack on Centauri Prime by the Narn and Drazi members of the IA.
Yep. Here's what jms had to say on Feb. 13, 2000:
Here's another short blurb from May 5, 2000:
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Pakmaraatemycat
Member
Yes. Makes sense now you point it out. It's just as he posed no apparent danger to anyone else whilst in the straight jacket, I didn't see the reason straight away. It would be a much more pleasant journey w/o nasty smells and illusions of fire.
So are some of the books actually worth reading then?
I was given a copy of the first one (Voices?), back in the 90s but binned it after just a couple of chapters as it was such badly written pulp fiction. I've never even thought about trying any of the others since...
Gotcha, it's more a personal vendetta than any (perceived) crime on the part of the EA.
P.S. Am I allowed to laugh at the irony that spell-check on a B5 msg board doesn't know words like Londo, Drazi and Narn?
